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Time for a new theory of money

Discussions about the economic and financial ramifications of PEAK OIL

Time for a new theory of money

Unread postby Graeme » Fri 29 Oct 2010, 19:11:17

Time for a new theory of money

The reason our financial system has routinely gotten into trouble, with periodic waves of depression like the one we’re battling now, may be due to a flawed perception not just of the roles of banking and credit but of the nature of money itself. In our economic adolescence, we have regarded money as a “thing”—something independent of the relationship it facilitates. But today there is no gold or silver backing our money. Instead, it’s created by banks when they make loans (that includes Federal Reserve Notes or dollar bills, which are created by the Federal Reserve, a privately-owned banking corporation, and lent into the economy). Virtually all money today originates as credit, or debt, which is simply a legal agreement to pay in the future.


The flaws in the current scheme are now being exposed in the major media, and it may well be coming down. The question then is what to replace it with. What is the next logical phase in our economic evolution?

Credit needs to come first. We as a community can create our own credit, without having to engage in the sort of impossible pyramid scheme in which we’re always borrowing from Peter to pay Paul at compound interest. We can avoid the pitfalls of privately-issued credit with a public credit system, a system banking on the future productivity of its members, guaranteed not by “things” shuffled around furtively in a shell game vulnerable to exposure, but by the community itself.

The simplest public credit model is the electronic community currency system. Consider, for example, one called “Friendly Favors.” The participating Internet community does not have to begin with a fund of capital or reserves, as is now required of private banking institutions. Nor do members borrow from a pool of pre-existing money on which they pay interest to the pool’s owners. They create their own credit, simply by debiting their own accounts and crediting someone else’s. If Jane bakes cookies for Sue, Sue credits Jane’s account with 5 “favors” and debits her own with 5. They have “created” money in the same way that banks do, but the result is not inflationary. Jane’s plus-5 is balanced against Sue’s minus-5, and when Sue pays her debt by doing something for someone else, it all nets out. It is a zero-sum game.


Community currency systems can be very functional on a small scale, but because they do not trade in the national currency, they tend to be too limited for large-scale businesses and projects. If they were to grow substantially larger, they could run up against the sort of exchange rate problems afflicting small countries. They are basically barter systems, not really designed for advancing credit on a major scale.

The functional equivalent of a community currency system can be achieved using the national currency, by forming a publicly owned bank. By turning banking into a public utility operated for the benefit of the community, the virtues of the expandable credit system of the medieval bankers can be retained, while avoiding the parasitic exploitation to which private banking schemes are prone. Profits generated by the community can be returned to the community.

A public bank that generates credit in the national currency could be established by a community or group of any size, but as long as we have capital and reserve requirements and other stringent banking laws, a state is the most feasible option. It can easily meet those requirements without jeopardizing the solvency of its collective owners.


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Re: Time for a new theory of money

Unread postby Ludi » Fri 29 Oct 2010, 19:17:24

Graeme wrote:The functional equivalent of a community currency system can be achieved using the national currency, by forming a publicly owned bank. By turning banking into a public utility operated for the benefit of the community



Oh nooooooo! Socialism!!! 8O 8O 8O
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Re: Time for a new theory of money

Unread postby Oakley » Fri 29 Oct 2010, 23:20:08

Ludi wrote:

Oh nooooooo! Socialism!!! 8O 8O 8O


In Colonial America there were several attempts at Colonial governments issuing scrip. They printed up the scrip and spent it into circulation.

This current proposal for States, instead of printing scrip on paper, is to print up checking account balances, and instead of spending it into circulation, is to loan it into circulation.

We know that the Colonial experiment created a boom, bust cycle where economic activity was stimulated by the spending and depressed when the stimulating effect burnt out. In each case the scrip lost value and people using it were screwed, and made ill advised investment decisions for which they suffered.

Our current monetary system is one where private banks have been given the privilege of creating checking account balances out of thin air and loaning (at interest) them into circulation. We know that this gives rise to a boom, bust cycle and depreciates the value of this money (inflation of prices). We are in the bust part of the cycle now.

No matter which entity creates credit (money) and no matter whether it is spent into circulation or loaned into circulation, we have a boom bust cycle and destruction of the value of money. Credit based monetary systems are unstable, predatory, and unsustainable.

Unless we use a stable monetary system, one which limits credit expansion to zero, or at best to self liquidating true bills, we will all suffer economic boom/bust cycles and have our pockets picked by the monetary system.

This proposal is ill conceived, and both misrepresents history and ignores significant historical events.

There is a reason that States were prohibited by the US Constitution from emitting bills of credit or making anything but gold and silver coins legal tender. There was a reason that during the Constitutional Convention the power of Congress to emit bills of credit (paper money) was discussed and discarded in favor of granting to Congress the power to coin money and regulate the value thereof. The bank suggested in this proposal, being a branch of the State could not issue credit since a checking account balance is nothing more than a modern day electronic bill of credit.
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Re: Time for a new theory of money

Unread postby Blacksmith » Sat 30 Oct 2010, 09:48:28

In Canada the government issues Money (ie IOU's) that is back by reserves held by the Bank of Canada ( USD and foreign currency) and a vague reference to the GDP. Since they no longer want nor indeed cannot back Money by precious metal and since this is a form dedicated to peak oil, I suggest Money be backed by energy units, so many joules or BTUs. The nice thing about this is that the only way the government could increase the suppy of money is to increase the supply of energy. Thus all our future energy needs would be met and we would bask in a supply of endless clean energy.
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Re: Time for a new theory of money

Unread postby mattduke » Sat 30 Oct 2010, 10:45:20

Getting the government out of the money business would be a good start.
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Re: Time for a new theory of money

Unread postby TheDude » Sat 30 Oct 2010, 21:35:34

Ludi wrote:
Graeme wrote:The functional equivalent of a community currency system can be achieved using the national currency, by forming a publicly owned bank. By turning banking into a public utility operated for the benefit of the community



Oh nooooooo! Socialism!!! 8O 8O 8O


"My answer to the Socialists is: bring 'em on."

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That's a dirty word of course. And the synonyms aren't much better: collectivist, state-controlled. Time for something from Classic tongues. You need to sell the sizzle.
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Re: Time for a new theory of money

Unread postby truecougarblue » Sat 30 Oct 2010, 23:43:52

In a world economy as dependent on energy as ours, why not make the basic unit of money equal a basic unit of energy, like the kWh. Energy can't be created nor destroyed, can't be inflated, and the money supply would expand and contract with the one item that best determines the ability of the economy to grow.

FWIW.
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Re: Time for a new theory of money

Unread postby dolanbaker » Sun 31 Oct 2010, 13:34:48

truecougarblue wrote:In a world economy as dependent on energy as ours, why not make the basic unit of money equal a basic unit of energy, like the kWh. Energy can't be created nor destroyed, can't be inflated, and the money supply would expand and contract with the one item that best determines the ability of the economy to grow.

FWIW.

You mean something like this...

An Energy Standard for a World Currency
Apparently Buckminster Fuller was first in 1969 to recommend, in his book Operating Manual for Spaceship Earth, that a global currency be based on energy; he called it the "Kilowatt Dollar".
http://www.roperld.com/science/CurrencySystems.htm

If this is suggested then we will be at out richest now, and money will "disappear" as the energy available for use shrinks.
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Re: Time for a new theory of money

Unread postby RDenner » Tue 02 Nov 2010, 01:02:29

This is something that I have been pondering for a long time, even since I woke up to how the monetary system really works.

One must look at how we view money to understand how ridiculous it really is and in the end how incredibly destructive and theiving it has become.

First understand what money is supposed to be and it becomes very easy to understand how messed up the system is and how it is so easily derailed.

Money IS A TOOL. It allows us to move beyond the barter system. Without money we revert to that old bugs bunny cartoon with Foghorn Leghorn(for those old enough to remember). In that cartoon the little chicken has to run around and figure out what everyone wants to ultimately get what he wants. The dog wants a bone, to get the bone he has to give the rats some cheese, to get the cheese he has to give the cow something. And on and on it goes. Finally after getting everything lined up, he gives everyone what they need and he finally gets his heart desire.

Had everyone just accepted some common "thing" as a currency, the little chicken could have just traded directly for what he wanted.

This is obvious and is econ 101 for probably most of the people here, but I bet most never think of money itself as a tool.... Replace green paper or even Gold metal with A SHOVEL... The green paper or the gold metal are used as a tool to accomplish a set goal of, let's say, building a home... But in this example we replace paper and metal with SHOVELS...

As someone looking to dig a hole for your building, you would aquire EXATLY the number of shovels you need to get the deed done, no more no less. There is no benefit in hoarding a bunch of shovels, UNLESS you make it so that holding on to shovels is of a benefit to you. You can hoard shovels and force all others who want to dig holes to come to you and as someone who has lots of shovels(maybe even having cornered the shovel market) you can charge whatever you want.

Now apply that thinking to our current system and it becomes obvious what is wrong with our financial system. That our money is allowed to be accumulated FOR GAIN is at the very heart of our economic problems and the fact that the rich always get richer and the poor are always behind the 8 ball.

The fact that the TOOL OF MONEY is allowed to be hoarded and saved is at the very heart of the Western worlds problems.. The only way that our current system could be salvaged is to introduce the idea of Devaluing monetary units. Money that looses value the longer you hold it. Seeing as that most transactions that one needs to carry out can be done in a matter of weeks or months would suggest a system that allows for the money to remain stable for somewhere between 3 month and possibly as long as 5 years on the very long end(big capital improvement type projects).

By making it a NEGATIVE to hold physical money, this will increase drastically the velocity of the money in ciruculation. There is anectdotal evidence, where this has been tried on very small scales, that very small amounts of physical money is need to satify the needs of a community. The fact that most people will move that money as quick as possible is at the very heart of this system.

People will find other ways to store value, like capital improvements on their property...

Not saying this is the end all beat all, but it was an idea that I read about from a book(lost the title sorry) that centered around an Austrian town during the later part of the Great Depression and into the first years of WWII... The lack of Deutch Marks led to 50% unemployment in this town and there was such a lack of physical money that the most simple of economic transactions could not take place...

The town elders came up with this alternate money system based on the above principals...

Fascinating stuff... I'll try and find the links.

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Re: Time for a new theory of money

Unread postby RDenner » Tue 02 Nov 2010, 01:09:42

But that would be a good thing wouldn't it?

You absolutely want a monetary unit that as closely as possible mimics the thermaldynamic reality of the economy. That is exactly the problem that the current system is facing right now.

The economy is based on the amount of "monetary units" in ciruculation and they think that by printing more units that somehow this will turn into something real, like more oil or more jobs or bigger factories.

It worked in the past because those "assumptions" were correct... They kept printing more and more money and the energy to realize that money as "real" was met by more and more energy production(which in turn meant more employment, more factories, etc)...

But the reason there is such an economic disconnect in the western world, is exactly because it has no way to deal with a contracting energy base. Our system knows only one direction and that is exponential growth.... The system CANNOT DEAL with contraction, period...

It is at the very center of the deflationary fear that the Fed is always working against... Once the system shifts into reverse, it doesn't go backwards at a slow and steady rate, it goes into reverse in an exponential way.. Think of the miracle of compound interest... ONLY RUNNING IN REVERSE..

Robert


dolanbaker wrote:
truecougarblue wrote:In a world economy as dependent on energy as ours, why not make the basic unit of money equal a basic unit of energy, like the kWh. Energy can't be created nor destroyed, can't be inflated, and the money supply would expand and contract with the one item that best determines the ability of the economy to grow.

FWIW.

You mean something like this...

An Energy Standard for a World Currency
Apparently Buckminster Fuller was first in 1969 to recommend, in his book Operating Manual for Spaceship Earth, that a global currency be based on energy; he called it the "Kilowatt Dollar".
http://www.roperld.com/science/CurrencySystems.htm

If this is suggested then we will be at out richest now, and money will "disappear" as the energy available for use shrinks.
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Re: Time for a new theory of money

Unread postby truecougarblue » Thu 04 Nov 2010, 23:54:12

Agreed Rdenner, and this would put just the right incentive on development of alternative energy sources as a new source = new wealth.

BTW, I know its not an original idea, and I also know that TPTB would never let it happen, but one's micro environment doesn't necessarily need to reflect the macro in all respects.
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Re: Time for a new theory of money

Unread postby Pretorian » Fri 05 Nov 2010, 03:47:52

We already had perfect money system: cacao beans. You can grow it, you can eat it, you can't hoard it
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