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QE2 may sentence 60 million in US to cold and hungry winter

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QE2 may sentence 60 million in US to cold and hungry winter

Unread postby Sixstrings » Sat 06 Nov 2010, 03:24:11

How Ben Bernanke Sentenced The Poorest 20% Of The Population To A Cold, Hungry Winter

The following chart prepared recently by JPMorgan demonstrates something rather scary, and makes it all too clear how the Chairman's plan to "assist" the US population via some imaginary "wealth effect" due to QE2, is about to backfire.

As is now becoming very evident, the prices of energy and food products are about to surge, and in many cases have already done so, but courtesy of some clever gimmicks (Wal Mart selling what was formerly 39 oz of coffee as a 33.9 oz product for example) the end consumers haven't quite felt it yet. They will soon. There is a limit to how much every commodity can open limit up before it appears on the SKU price at one's local grocer.

And while a marginally declining "core CPI" is irrelevant for this exercise as it measures only items that are completely outside of the scope of everyday life, what will be far more important to end consumers will be the push higher in food and energy costs. The problem, however, is that for the lowest 20% of Americans, as per the BLS, food and energy purchases represent over 50% of their after-tax income (a number which drops to 10% for the wealthiest twenty percentile).

In other words should rampant liquidity end up pushing food and energy prices to double (something that is a distinct possibility currently), Ben Bernanke may have very well sentenced about 60 million Americans to a hungry and very cold winter, let alone having any resources to buy trinkets with the imaginary wealth effect which for over 80% of the US population will never come.
Image
http://www.zerohedge.com/article/how-ben-bernanke-sentenced-poorest-20-population-cold-hungry-winter


Zerohedge has been getting a lot doomier lately. To be fair, I question the likelihood of food and energy DOUBLING before the winter's out. But if he's right, then he's also right that the poorest 20% are really screwed -- they already spend over 50% of their income on food an energy.

And we all know the Republican congress won't give a damn -- they're out to cut the entitlements already in place, not offer more help to America's cold and hungry lower class (and formerly middle class but now unemployed). By the way, don't forget that "the poor" includes a lot of elderly folks, who you'd think should be blameless but I guess Republicans think gramma is just lazy too. :roll:
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Re: QE2 may sentence 60 million in US to cold and hungry win

Unread postby Cloud9 » Sat 06 Nov 2010, 10:01:36

There are three sources of government money. 1. Taxes: At the present time roughly half of us pay federal income tax and half of us don’t. You can take the last shred of income from the half that pays taxes and it still will not be enough to cover the cost of Social Security, Medicaid and Medicare. Having taken every shred of income from the producers, there is nothing left to pay for the running of the bureaucracy or fighting of our wars. 2. Borrowing: The chief purchasers of our debt, China and Japan have recently shown a lack of interest in purchasing anymore American paper. The Federal Reserve is now functioning of the lender of last resort and soon will become the largest holder of national debt. There is no limit as to how much money the Federal Reserve can lend to the government. Which brings us to the final choice: 3. Printing money: The bank that prints the money with a mouse click is now covering government’s daily operational expenses. So the real truth is the people of the United States are not even close to paying for the operational costs of our government in the form of taxes.

What has happened is that the politicians have opted for a stealth tax in the form of inflation. Anyone with a basic understanding of economics knows that when more dollars are chasing the same amount of goods the price of those goods goes up.

Who will this tax in the form of higher prices impact the most, the rich or the poor? The answer is the poor. It is the poor that spends a larger portion of their base income to cover the necessities of food, fuel and housing. The top ten percent can pay ten dollars a gallon for gasoline and not even blink. The rest of us will ride bicycles.

So, which would you rather have, an orderly planned reduction in programs and services or a collapse?
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Re: QE2 may sentence 60 million in US to cold and hungry win

Unread postby Ludi » Sat 06 Nov 2010, 10:12:25

Conservatives and other anti-guvmint types argue that the guvmint shouldn't have to take care of people, that their churches and communities can take care of them. So I expect all conservatives to be caring for as many families as they can this winter. In Ye Olde Days in England the land owners were expected to care for the poor who lived on their land, and to build houses for them, etc. If a landowner didn't do this, he was not respected by his peers. The top 2% of our country seem to aspire to the position of the gentry and so should be prepared to take on the responsibilities of the gentry. If they don't, it just shows how empty their philosophy is. :x
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Re: QE2 may sentence 60 million in US to cold and hungry win

Unread postby Cloud9 » Sat 06 Nov 2010, 10:38:09

Ludi, which would you prefer, prices so high that government assistance checks won’t buy a month’s worth of food or fewer people on government assistance? I’m a government employee and you people need to cut my salary. I will either suffer a reduction of salary or a reduction in purchasing power. A reduction of salary is orderly and can be managed. A currency collapse is sudden and catastrophic and will starve us all.
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Re: QE2 may sentence 60 million in US to cold and hungry win

Unread postby Oakley » Sat 06 Nov 2010, 11:36:19

Cloud9 wrote:There are three sources of government money. 1. Taxes: At the present time roughly half of us pay federal income tax and half of us don’t. You can take the last shred of income from the half that pays taxes and it still will not be enough to cover the cost of Social Security, Medicaid and Medicare. Having taken every shred of income from the producers, there is nothing left to pay for the running of the bureaucracy or fighting of our wars. 2. Borrowing: The chief purchasers of our debt, China and Japan have recently shown a lack of interest in purchasing anymore American paper. The Federal Reserve is now functioning of the lender of last resort and soon will become the largest holder of national debt. There is no limit as to how much money the Federal Reserve can lend to the government. Which brings us to the final choice: 3. Printing money: The bank that prints the money with a mouse click is now covering government’s daily operational expenses. So the real truth is the people of the United States are not even close to paying for the operational costs of our government in the form of taxes.

What has happened is that the politicians have opted for a stealth tax in the form of inflation. Anyone with a basic understanding of economics knows that when more dollars are chasing the same amount of goods the price of those goods goes up.

Who will this tax in the form of higher prices impact the most, the rich or the poor? The answer is the poor. It is the poor that spends a larger portion of their base income to cover the necessities of food, fuel and housing. The top ten percent can pay ten dollars a gallon for gasoline and not even blink. The rest of us will ride bicycles.

So, which would you rather have, an orderly planned reduction in programs and services or a collapse?


Great post.

When the economy contracts, someone gets less because there is less to be had. Clearly those in government think they should not receive less, hence their failure to spend less, so if they are taking an equal or larger share of the contracting economic pie, someone else must suffer an even greater reduction in what they get. How the federal government manages to fund taking their larger share you have described.

Clearly the powerful financial interest on Wall Street, in the banking industry, and in corporate America do not want to see a reduction in their own standards of living and also are pulling the strings of politicians to insure their own comfort by taking a larger share of the contracting pie. So who is left to suffer the effect of the contraction? Everyone else.

If we had followed the US Constitution Article 1, Sections 8 and 10, our money supply would be gold and silver coins and/or certificates in circulation (dollar bills) that represented a 100% backed claim on these coins held in the vaults of the US Treasury. This coupled with a 100% reserve requirement for commercial banks would insure a secure and stable money supply, and would limit government spending to what they could tax or borrow from the existing money supply. The stealth transfer of wealth to government and special interest, open fraud, would not exist.

The present unconstitutional, unstable, unsustainable, predatory monetary system transfers wealth from the majority into the pockets of special interests on Wall Street and banks. It creates boom/bust cycles. It makes it possible for government to take on massive debt that ultimately cannot be repaid and will probably result in the collapse and end of the federal government.

We clearly are in the bust phase of the monetary cycle. But this bust phase, unlike the last major bust in the 1930's, is superimposed on the plateau phase of the industrial age expansion. The industrial age expansion began in the 18th century and is ending in the current century. Those who have been in power were able to get away with all sorts of manipulation and fraud during the expansion phase of the industrial age, because even as those in power increased their share of the expanding pie, the majority still saw a generally improved standard of living on their progressively smaller share of the bigger pie. But now that the cold and hunger is at our doorsteps, the current system of plunder and control will no longer be tolerated. We face civil disorder, whether it will be civil war or revolution is yet to be seen, but the pain and suffering being dealt out by those in power will certainly bring us to violence.

I see the US as being comprised of three factions. Those in power who gladly use that power to rig the economy in their own favor at the expense of the rest of us. This group includes the politicians and bureaucrats of the federal and state governments and those powerful corporate interests who pull their strings. The second group is those out of power who want to continue the system of government plunder and control, but want to direct the largesse to themselves instead of to political and corporate thieves. This group includes the Republican and Democrat voters who have a fundamental belief in the sanctity of government, and who hold the delusion that all we need to do is send better people to rule us. The third group is those out of power who do not want to continue with government plunder and control and prefer to live in a free society. This group includes Libertarians and anarchists, and to a limited degree, some of those in the Tea Party movement. When the violence comes, it will be a struggle among these three vaguely defined factions. I say "vaguely defined" because at this point, I think many people do not even understand themselves where they stand, but soon circumstances will force greater factionalization, and just as during the American Revolution of 1775 or the Civil War of 1861, people at their own peril will be forced to take sides. If you think this will not happen, I remind you that we are just at the beginning of both the cyclical monetary contraction and just the beginning of the down leg of the industrial age. Incorporated into the die-off is the competitive struggle to survive, just as nature commands.
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Re: QE2 may sentence 60 million in US to cold and hungry win

Unread postby Plantagenet » Sat 06 Nov 2010, 11:45:01

Sixstrings wrote:
And we all know the Republican congress won't give a damn -- I guess Republicans think gramma is just lazy


Trying to blame the Republicans for the democratic Congress's bloated budget and Obama administration policy of printing more money in order to fund Obama's huge government deficits is silly.

The only way to stop QE2 (and QE3, 4 and 5) is to support Republican efforts to cut government spending and reduce the deficit.
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Re: QE2 may sentence 60 million in US to cold and hungry win

Unread postby Lore » Sat 06 Nov 2010, 11:59:24

Plantagenet wrote:The only way to stop QE2 (and QE3, 4 and 5) is to support Republican efforts to cut government spending and reduce the deficit.


You mean the Republicans actually have adopted a plan to cut government spending and reduce the deficit, let's see it?
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Re: QE2 may sentence 60 million in US to cold and hungry win

Unread postby Plantagenet » Sat 06 Nov 2010, 12:22:27

Lore wrote:
Plantagenet wrote:The only way to stop QE2 (and QE3, 4 and 5) is to support Republican efforts to cut government spending and reduce the deficit.


You mean the Republicans actually have adopted a plan to cut government spending and reduce the deficit, let's see it?


You don't understand how the government works, do you?

The Democrats currently control the Congress---it is impossible for any bill not supported by Pelosi and democrats to even get to the floor, much less get a vote, much less get adopted.

Even after the new Republican Congress takes office in January, the dems will still control the Senate and the presidency. That means Obama and the dems will still be pushing for more spending and the Fed will still be printing money to reduce the value of the dollar (i.e. QE2).
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Re: QE2 may sentence 60 million in US to cold and hungry win

Unread postby Oakley » Sat 06 Nov 2010, 12:23:05

Ludi wrote:Conservatives and other anti-guvmint types argue that the guvmint shouldn't have to take care of people, that their churches and communities can take care of them. So I expect all conservatives to be caring for as many families as they can this winter. In Ye Olde Days in England the land owners were expected to care for the poor who lived on their land, and to build houses for them, etc. If a landowner didn't do this, he was not respected by his peers. The top 2% of our country seem to aspire to the position of the gentry and so should be prepared to take on the responsibilities of the gentry. If they don't, it just shows how empty their philosophy is. :x


What does government do? For one thing they rig the economy in favor of a few at the expense of the many. The few include the banks, the politicians themselves, and other corporate interests. This rigging produces poverty. So then government claims to cure poverty by taking some more of the wealth of those who have not been completely plundered and giving it to those completely plundered.. Government charity does buy votes to keep the powerful in power, and it keeps those at the extreme bottom marginally alive.

You talk about empty philosophy. How philosophically empty is the current system of fraud and theft? If I point a gun at you and demand your money, that is theft. If a gang of ten points guns at you and demand your money, that is theft. If a gang calling themselves government points guns at you and demand your money, that is theft. If the laws arrange the economy so that one group always wins and another always loses, that is theft by fraud. If government takes one man's wealth to give to another, even with charitable intent, that is theft. We cannot hire some else to do what we cannot do ourselves, so we cannot hire someone else to commit a theft on our behalves. We cannot authorize government to do what we, ourselves, cannot legally do.

Most normal people have compassion for our fellow men, and it is from this impulse that charity arises. Forced charity destroys charitable impulses; it changes how we see the needy from object of compassion into blood sucking welfare bums. Government charity is expensive because a large percentage goes to administration. Government charity invites fraud because of the inefficiency of government.

No system of charity is perfect, but private charity historically worked much better than forced charity, especially in times of economic expansion. Much of it was invisible because it was people privately out of the public eye helping those they saw as needy.

So I suggest that the collectivist compassion approach is not only morally bankrupt, but a very ineffective way to deal with a problem that was first created by the very big government that collectivists view as sacrosanct instead of evil.
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Re: QE2 may sentence 60 million in US to cold and hungry win

Unread postby Lore » Sat 06 Nov 2010, 12:46:53

Plantagenet wrote:
Lore wrote:
Plantagenet wrote:The only way to stop QE2 (and QE3, 4 and 5) is to support Republican efforts to cut government spending and reduce the deficit.


You mean the Republicans actually have adopted a plan to cut government spending and reduce the deficit, let's see it?


You don't understand how the government works, do you?

The Democrats currently control the Congress---it is impossible for any bill not supported by Pelosi and democrats to even get to the floor, much less get a vote, much less get adopted.

Even after the new Republican Congress takes office in January, the dems will still control the Senate and the presidency. That means Obama and the dems will still be pushing for more spending and the Fed will still be printing money to reduce the value of the dollar (i.e. QE2).


I think I have a better then average understanding of how the government works.

What were the Republicans doing the last four years? Just voting no? You mean they didn’t have time between doing that and filibustering to even come up with a sensible counter piece of legislation that they could agree on amongst themselves? Guess not. For that matter what were they doing the previous six years when they doubled the deficit under Bush and had control of all three branches of government?
The things that will destroy America are prosperity-at-any-price, peace-at-any-price, safety-first instead of duty-first, the love of soft living, and the get-rich-quick theory of life.
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Re: QE2 may sentence 60 million in US to cold and hungry win

Unread postby Plantagenet » Sat 06 Nov 2010, 12:59:53

Lore wrote:What were the Republicans doing the last four years? Just voting no?


Why don't you know these things already? :roll:

The Republicans voted "no" in the last two years to try to stop Obamacare and other Obama policies.
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Re: QE2 may sentence 60 million in US to cold and hungry win

Unread postby Lore » Sat 06 Nov 2010, 13:16:27

Plantagenet wrote:
Lore wrote:What were the Republicans doing the last four years? Just voting no?


Why don't you know these things already? :roll:

The Republicans voted "no" in the last two years to try to stop Obamacare and other Obama policies.


I see, so you're going to ignore the questions.
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Re: QE2 may sentence 60 million in US to cold and hungry win

Unread postby Ludi » Sat 06 Nov 2010, 13:22:39

Lore wrote:
Plantagenet wrote:
Lore wrote:What were the Republicans doing the last four years? Just voting no?


Why don't you know these things already? :roll:

The Republicans voted "no" in the last two years to try to stop Obamacare and other Obama policies.


I see, so you're going to ignore the questions.



The only plan the Republicans have is "destroy Obama." They have nothing positive to offer, as far as they have indicated. Maybe they have a secret plan somewhere to fix things, but the only plan they have provided is "destroy Obama."

Happy to see some other plan which they intend to implement once they have destroyed Obama.

Still waiting for it.

:?:
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Re: QE2 may sentence 60 million in US to cold and hungry win

Unread postby Cloud9 » Sat 06 Nov 2010, 14:37:39

Ludi, I am a registered republican. My sentiments lie with the tea partiers and the civil libertarians. I did not vote for your president. I do not particularly like our President but one of the last things on the planet I would like to see is for him to be destroyed. He has done more for the self-esteem of the black kids in my classroom than anybody ever could. He takes a great picture and he is a world class speaker.

My son on the other hand is democrat and a trial lawyer and he absolutely fell in love with President Obama during his campaign. Both he and his wife voted for him. Today he absolutely despises him. From my son’s perspective, he has broken all of his promises. The healthcare that he promised turned out to be a political and economic nightmare that did nothing but pump pork into home districts and subsidize the insurance and medical professions. We are still in both wars. Unemployment has gotten worse. He has pumped about a trillion and a half into the economy inflating commodity prices around the world. Anytime you look for him, he is either on the golf course or on vacation and he has done nothing to put the fraudsters and banksters on Wall Street in jail.

The difference between the two of us is expectations. My son expected him to do what he promised. I expected him to represent his self interest and the interest of the Chicago political machine that put him in power. Like all of us, his background made him what he is. In his heart of hearts he believes what Reverend Wright told him. He is a socialist and a racist. I knew that those sentiments would be to a large extent constrained by his own party and the demands of the office. Aside from starting a nuclear war or sending in the storm troopers, the greatest danger he posed to the republic was in his Supreme Court appointees.

I am quite concerned that these two ladies will be a thorn in our side for the next quarter of a century.

Still I am the eternal optimist and believe the republic will survive. I would be pleasantly pleased if the President finishes out his term and then proceeds to do what he does best, travel and give speeches.
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Re: QE2 may sentence 60 million in US to cold and hungry win

Unread postby Cog » Sat 06 Nov 2010, 14:50:20

I will be happy if there is no significant legislation that passes from either the Repubs or the Dems over the next two years. Unlike some others on this board, I prefer local solutions and people figuring out for themselves how to build their own personal lifeboat.
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Re: QE2 may sentence 60 million in US to cold and hungry win

Unread postby Cloud9 » Sat 06 Nov 2010, 15:26:48

Indeed to steal from someone wiser than myself,The greatest threat to our liberty exists while the legislature is in session.
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Re: QE2 may sentence 60 million in US to cold and hungry win

Unread postby Lore » Sat 06 Nov 2010, 15:49:19

GASMON wrote:Same here in the UK - probably worse.

What to do - ?? Action needed fquickly.

Gas


I guess you could row over to your friends in France and get support. They love a good protest in the streets.
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Re: QE2 may sentence 60 million in US to cold and hungry win

Unread postby Fiddlerdave » Sat 06 Nov 2010, 16:13:47

Oakley wrote:No system of charity is perfect, but private charity historically worked much better than forced charity, especially in times of economic expansion. Much of it was invisible because it was people privately out of the public eye helping those they saw as needy.

So I suggest that the collectivist compassion approach is not only morally bankrupt, but a very ineffective way to deal with a problem that was first created by the very big government that collectivists view as sacrosanct instead of evil.
I wonder just what engenders this fantasy that somehow, "private charity works better". This comment that we "didn't notice private charity because it was out of the public eye" is rather ironic. The whole reason Social Security was started was because of the terrible plight of the elderly - their starvation and homelessness and death in gutters was what provided the popular impetus for this huge program.

I do not want to denigrate private charity, and those who contribute considerable money to it. But the elderly and sick need food day in and day out, doctors and medicine, rent to pay and and there were and are no charities providing that.

The historical practice of small towns providing some relief did some good, but as always, it was heavy on the "help those they saw as needy", which would not include any minority, children of "loose women", strangers, people of a different religion, or any of the million other reasons so many small towns consider people as "different" and suspicious or undeserving.
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Re: QE2 may sentence 60 million in US to cold and hungry win

Unread postby Cog » Sat 06 Nov 2010, 16:47:30

There are roughly 6 billion undeserving people on the planet. How many do you intend to help? We are so far into overshoot we will be lucky to save anyone.
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