[deMolay]

Unemployment has moved up to 9.6% and is the highest in 27 years. Coupled with this bad news. http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-0 ... -says.html

[Daniel_Plainview]

[Under Obama], more than an eighth of the population, will get food stamps each month ...

[Sixstrings]

Unemployment has moved up to 9.6% and is the highest in 27 years. Coupled with this bad news. http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-0 ... -says.html

Meh, who cares that 41 million Americans can't feed themselves without government assistance. We're still number one! USA! USA!

The rich are doing better than ever, income inequality is at 19th Century gilded age levels, and according to another thread on this site the "recession is over." Gee, if only the jobless and hungry would just eat cake and stop mucking up our lovely gated communities.

Brother, can you spare some Freedom Fries?

[Ludi]

In case I decide to vote Republican or some other party next time, what is the Republican (or other party) solution to this problem of so many people on food stamps?

<<<<not on food stamps (quite)

[Buggy]

Bread and circuses my friend. Bread and circuses. the Food Stamps program provides the bread (if you have ever stood in the supermarket checkout line behind somebody using their "Food Stamps" credit card, you know that bread is rarely in their cart. Pepsi and Cheetos is what I have seen). And for our circuses, why it's whatever Miley Cyrus wore out last night and the latest snap shots of Lindsey Lohan's nether regions. Who could ask for anything more???? Bill Gates and Warren Buffet can keep their money. They don't know what they're missing!!!!!

[Outcast_Searcher]

In case I decide to vote Republican or some other party next time, what is the Republican (or other party) solution to this problem of so many people on food stamps?

<<<<not on food stamps (quite)

They don't (have an answer Ludi. The GOP will claim that tax cuts and making government smaller will spur the economy. And then they'll spend as much as possible on defense, watch the deficits soar (even more) short term, and tell you to be patient, since the economy will grow faster with lower taxes. (And before you GOPer's scream, past tax cuts like Reagans DO increase deficits, especially in the short run. And if you say the GOP won't spend a lot on defense, then based on history and recent GOP rhetoric - you're delusional or a liar).

The libertarians (of which I am one) would want the government doing less wealth transfers, so they'd be like the republicans except wouldn't be spending a fortune on defense. I'm sure that's not what you'd want either. (At least I'm willing to be honest about it). This, BTW, is why I want a small government -- since government doesn't tend to provide efficient or quality solutions over time, for the most part -- having lots of it just results in other problems, including thugs redistributing lots of economic output.

I guess this may seem harsh or pessimistic, but where have we really gotten via the war on poverty, the war on drugs, our military ventures post WW II, and our giant pile of legislation and government run entities like the post office? I contend it hasn't been worth the MANY MANY trillions of dollars and lost opportunity cost the public has paid.

[Fiddlerdave]

In case I decide to vote Republican or some other party next time, what is the Republican (or other party) solution to this problem of so many people on food stamps?

<<<<not on food stamps (quite)

Since the country is still a few hundred trillion in the hole from the fantasy wealth generation of the Bush Republicans, there is no way to create another fantasy economy like the 2005-2007 frenzy.

They will now simply cut food stamps and cut unemployment and other safety net programs to up the "Desperation Factor", (all while the weekly millions in payments (bribes) to the "Awakening" insurgents continues).

Minimum wage will be eliminated, and America's middle class will then find employment working for $4 an hour, which will theoretically allow businesses to hire twice as many workers! Voila! Full employment.

That is the plan, and even if you are not laid off, that income level is soon to be your new baseline! Enjoy the sweet smell of corporate government control, American workers! (A mixture of the aroma of open trench outhouses and garbage in the streets from all the people living at below-subsistence income.)

[deMolay]

When the Chinese quit buying US debt, then the cuts to entitlements will sky rocket. "Millions Saved or Created". From the Best Used Car Salesman that the USA ever produced.

[MarkJ]

A record amount of Americans are On The Dole.

WASHINGTON — Government anti-poverty programs that have grown to meet the needs of recession victims now serve a record one in six Americans and are continuing to expand.

More than 50 million Americans are on Medicaid, the federal-state program aimed principally at the poor, a survey of state data by USA TODAY shows. That's up at least 17% since the recession began in December 2007.

The program has grown even before the new health care law adds about 16 million people, beginning in 2014.

More than 40 million people get food stamps, an increase of nearly 50% during the economic downturn, according to government data through May. The program has grown steadily for three years.

Caseloads have risen as more people become eligible. The economic stimulus law signed by President Obama last year also boosted benefits.

Close to 10 million receive unemployment insurance, nearly four times the number from 2007. Benefits have been extended by Congress eight times beyond the basic 26-week program, enabling the long-term unemployed to get up to 99 weeks of benefits. Caseloads peaked at nearly 12 million in January — "the highest numbers on record," says Christine Riordan of the National Employment Law Project, which advocates for low-wage workers.

More than 4.4 million people are on welfare, an 18% increase during the recession. The program has grown slower than others, causing Brookings Institution expert Ron Haskins to question its effectiveness in the recession.

As caseloads for all the programs have soared, so have costs. The federal price tag for Medicaid has jumped 36% in two years, to $273 billion. Jobless benefits have soared from $43 billion to $160 billion. The food stamps program has risen 80%, to $70 billion. Welfare is up 24%, to $22 billion. Taken together, they cost more than Medicare.

Medicaid spending and fraud are major issues in states like New York where property taxes are among the highest in the nation and a substantial amount of Medicaid funding comes from Property Taxes. Our Medicaid spending is the highest in the nation as well. In some regions, more than 50 percent of property taxes cover just one bill - Medicaid.

The Nation will also be adding 16 Million new Medicaid recipients by 2014.

The facts surrounding the magnitude of New York State’s Medicaid program are astonishing at $52 Billion, that’s one billion dollars every week,” said Santulli. “It is larger than the total individual budgets of 43 other states. If New York’s Medicaid program was a business it would rank 35th on the Fortune 500 list. It comprises nearly 30 percent of all healthcare spending.

[Ludi]

So what is the GOP plan to fix the economy?

[deMolay]

So far the Dems have been calling them the Party of No. Seems to indicate that even tho the Dems have controlled the House for 4 years and 2 years with a Super Majority they have been resisting Mo spending. Welfare spending now exceeds every single other item in the Obama Budget. It exceeds all Military Spending, followed in number 3 position with payments on the Interest on the Debt to pay for Welfare. It's The Spending Stupid.

[Fiddlerdave]

So far the Dems have been calling them the Party of No. Seems to indicate that even tho the Dems have controlled the House for 4 years and 2 years with a Super Majority they have been resisting Mo spending. Welfare spending now exceeds every single other item in the Obama Budget. It exceeds all Military Spending, followed in number 3 position with payments on the Interest on the Debt to pay for Welfare. It's The Spending Stupid.

Gee, hand Obama an economy that is already losing millions of jobs and it is "Obama" who increased welfare spending?

I'd say the top 10% who have doubled their own income and wealth growth at the expense of everyone else should get the finger for the welfare growth. Of course, as far as the Right is concerned, the USA resembling a 3rd world country with a wealthy crust and crushed middle class is their ideal outcome! So many more desperate workers low wage workers that way, ya know! Of course these businessmen better hope their anticipated market of Chinese and Indian middle class likes their products, the American middle class will be buying sustenance only.

[Ludi]

Gee, hand Obama an economy that is already losing millions of jobs and it is "Obama" who increased welfare spending?

How will cutting "welfare" (Social Security) improve the economy and get more people off food stamps?

[efarmer]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Sta ... ral_budget

Take a look at what the spending is for and then what the income is from here.
One pie chart above the other. Look at the income tax haul and then look at
the input from Social Security and Health premiums being collected.

So say we pursue cut off of the welfare spending and Social Security payments, but be honest and cut
off the Social Security income to the federal government (which will have to be coincident
with cutting off outputs).

Next realize that Defense is often corporate welfare and government job creation in disguise
since weapons and defense spending unlike consumer manufacturing and service, has to stay in
America to a large extent. But this has to be cut as well as welfare if you are really to walk the
walk of austerity back to a fiscally sound nation.

The societal shocks delivered to the nation via any abrupt changes like this will be so profound as to undermine the ability of anyone of any particular philosophy or set of principles, including close adherence to our founding principles, to be able to maintain order or power in the nation long enough to achieve any worthwhile objective.

The men without plans but chock full of noble principles can not be rehabbing or they would have plans, so I am left to conclude they are simply dismantling while the scrap value is highest. They got the bulk of the treasure on the last raid.

I see a Viking ship coming up the river again, they have been here before, the place is not what it was before they visited last, the rumor is they are here to restore order and rebuild and that they are not drunk and filled with blood lust. They are however, largely the same men in the same boats.
I wonder how many will help this time for a share of the plunder and a ticket to Valhalla?

[Ludi]

Cut off the welfare spending and Social Security payments

So the GOP plan to get people off Food Stamps is to cut the Food Stamp program?

And the hungry people are supposed to do what?

[efarmer]

I edited my post, I needed to say that more clearly, Ludi.


I had a neighbor who was the life of the saloon, buying rounds and snacks for the entire place,
talking big business deals, and waxing poetic about all the issues of the day. Waking up broke on Sunday morning, the family got a speech about how they had to tighten their belts and go austere for the success of the family. Many of us neighbors covered a kid or two for lunch or a movie or a clothing purchase in addition to our own. This is called private charity. We have a political party in America that believes this is a national strategy. The way they describe it, private charity just has to fill the gap until all the great deals they are cutting at the money saloon trickle down and the old man comes home with a big wad of money to play catch up with the little people.

[AgentR]

To the various comments of "what would the GOP do?"... Please, the last thing any of them would touch is food stamps. Yall are looking at food stamps the wrong way. Its not a charity or social program at all; its a farm subsidy & stabilization program.

What was the problem in the great depression with regard to food? Was it that farmers couldn't grow or plant? No. They couldn't sell. No buyers. They'd get stuck with a bunch of produce that would quickly go from valuable asset, to expensive trash, and helpless to do anything about it. Food stamps guarantee that the food MARKET remains liquid at least for basic commodities. So the financial cycle of the farmer can continue even if the normal economy goes belly up. Grow food, harvest food, sell food, pay mortgage/taxes, buy seed, grow food... Any break in that financial chain and things go real bad, real fast.

Social security, again, bottom of the priorities for cutting.

That said, the whole notion of looking to politicians to fix the PRIVATE economy is just absolutely nuts.

As my own views about waging war while keeping taxes low is at odds with the official GOP position, I'll pass on defending what they WOULD do. My own vote though is in their camp, because the freedoms I care about are thought of in a positive light by the GOP and a negative light by the Democrats.

[Ludi]

the freedoms I care about are thought of in a positive light by the GOP and a negative light by the Democrats.

2nd Amendment?

[AgentR]

Wrong forum to discuss, but the 10th is more important to me than the 2nd, but the 2nd remains much more important to me than government handouts. Don't want to pull this thread in the direction of a different topic though.

Basic point... you might as well forget the liberal fantasy of the Republicans cutting food stamps. It benefits their constituents much more than it benefits the lefties.

[Ludi]

Basic point... you might as well forget the liberal fantasy of the Republicans cutting food stamps. It benefits their constituents much more than it benefits the lefties.

Ok, but I do see Republicans talking about cutting "welfare" and I wonder what they mean. They don't seem interested in clarifying, so it's easy to get sucked into a liberal fantasy of them cutting food stamps, social security, etc.