[teotwawki]

Some believe that TBTP & Global Elite allowed Capitalism (and the rising tides that lifted the average economic/capitalistic slave's standard of living) to "run its course" because it suited those at the very top of the ponzi pyramid scheme/food chain, and like bacteria in a petri dish, when the "going was good", this kind of emulative anthropic Laissez-faire benefited the TBTP the most... and while yes it was good for the average citizen of one of the industrialized superpowers, that was just a mere byproduct side effect...

Since from all aspects (resource, energy, environment, economy, and even technology) we will have or had or soon will have "peaked"/climaxed/apex-ed/etc... This leaves those on the very top really just a few options..

TBTP can either pretend everything is "fine" and keep the illusion going for as LONG AS POSSIBLE, right up until things finally reach a breaking point, buckles, and TBTP then does an about-face and rapidly depopulate the global population of humans, spare a couple million of us to help them run the post-dieoff society, and that ways this "cannibalization" will ensure their survival for many more decades/centuries to come... this is resource conservation to the extreme.

And the fact that this forced depopulation hasn't yet happened could mean 1) we haven't quite reached that bifurcation point yet OR 2) they are planning something else... OR 3) stuff just happens and there is no all powerful TPTB

It goes like this. We go to school to learn, education is a mere means to an end.. to what end? To find a good job. But work is merely another means to an end. It is about money, and money translates into consumption.. resource consumption..

So the more we try to "fix the problem" the worse it will get. Resource depletion (due to over consumption) is the REASON why the eCONomy is in a bind. And yet our instinctive impulse is to look at the high unemployment rate as "bad" and that we need to "do" (usually amounts to consuming more resources or something equally wasteful) something to "fix" it. So more people go to school (thus increasing consumption) and we try to create more jobs (thus increasing consumption) and we do all this under the ostensible pretense of "fixing the economy"... As if we can "fix" over-consumption by indulging in even more over-consumption...

What is worse is back in the 70's most people didn't even NEED a college degree to find a livable wage job. Now a days everyone is getting higher and higher education degrees, just the job market is worse and worse... Even a PhD does not guarantee a job, much less a good paying job.. And yet everyone and their pet goldfish is going to school, retraining, et al... Education bubble or not, more real resources than every before are wasted on this, and yet to the detriment of all....

It is hard to believe that so many people still believe that "knowledge is power" and that we that we have transcended beyond the industrial age and into the "informational age of the connected economy" and that Omega Point is almost here and we shall witness convergence of singularity and all will be well.. As if this intellectualism was somehow disconnected from physicality. So many still want to beLIEve that work ethic is the way to prosperity... It essence everything we do translates into this contradiction: when each of us consumes more resources, all of us will have even more resources to consume. This might have held true on the up-slope of energy use, but alas not on the down-slope or decline of peak.

So the perfect economic plan goes like this:

1. Through use of strategic global monetary policy create an artificial global great depression much worse than anything anyone has ever seen before
2. As people start to die/starve/etc they will give up all rights, freedoms, expectations, ideologies, etc.. and will be especially mold-able and open to unorthodox suggestions. Consolidate into NWO.
3. Enact global policy to restrict to one-child-policy. Give economic incentives to those that waive the right to have children. Keep in place until global population down to 100 million.
4. Mandatory euthanasia at age ~55. Make this the global age limit cap for citizens and population.
5. Cease all advanced health-care treatments (reserve them only for the elite) this is not so much to save money and resources as it is to let nature take its course, and put evolution (or more accurately : pressures of natural selection ) back into the drivers seat.
6. Create self-perpetuating and self-sustaining robots and ai and electronic automation systems that produce much of the food, and necessities of survival for mankind in an automated set-and-forget kind of way that only requires minimum supervision and the occasional high level overseeing...
7. This means most the population can be as little as a couple of million of workers and the elite can still sustain themselves and the fabric society can still be intact.
8. Other than learning how to operate and maintain the equipment, most people will never need to learn, go to school, work, etc...



Or the elite TBTP might have a better plan. Their plan is not to have a plan. They are probably waiting for the perfect moment to flip the switch and then.....

[americandream]

An high net worth investor who has grown accustomed to a return of 10% minimum on his investment is not going to forego this for a steady state 2% in order to secure the system that grants him that return. Gluttony and stupidity is the name of the game with these cretins and they will be equally as surprised as all the other dolts are when collapse ensues.

[teotwawki]

An high net worth investor who has grown accustomed to a return of 10% minimum on his investment is not going to forego this for a steady state 2% in order to secure the system that grants him that return. Gluttony and stupidity is the name of the game with these cretins and they will be equally as surprised as all the other dolts are when collapse ensues.

"Time value of monies" (or any other investment growth) is based on aggregate growth of economy as a whole. Roughly speaking, growth translates into increased consumption. TPTB are smart enough to have long since figured out that it is far wiser (on the downslope) to conserve the remaining resources for themselves than to get a so-called lucrative "return" by sustaining the massess and enabling them to live/consume alongside.

[SeaGypsy]

An high net worth investor who has grown accustomed to a return of 10% minimum on his investment is not going to forego this for a steady state 2% in order to secure the system that grants him that return. Gluttony and stupidity is the name of the game with these cretins and they will be equally as surprised as all the other dolts are when collapse ensues.

WTF do you invest in then mister ethical communist investor? Rangoon uniform factories?

[Sys1]

It's not a global strategy. That's a jungle where lions are bigger than savan.
Welcome to the jungle!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mr7EBuz- ... re=related

[SeaGypsy]

4. Mandatory euthanasia at age ~55. Make this the global age limit cap for citizens and population.

5. Cease all advanced health-care treatments (reserve them only for the elite) this is not so much to save money and resources as it is to let nature take its course, and put evolution

.....

Congratulations! You win the honour of being labelled by me as the biggest idiot ever on this site!
Your prize, if you wish to collect it, is a sock in the kisser!

Jerk. OMG!

[americandream]

4. Mandatory euthanasia at age ~55. Make this the global age limit cap for citizens and population.

5. Cease all advanced health-care treatments (reserve them only for the elite) this is not so much to save money and resources as it is to let nature take its course, and put evolution

.....

Congratulations! You win the honour of being labelled by me as the biggest idiot ever on this site!
Your prize, if you wish to collect it, is a sock in the kisser!

Jerk. OMG!

In a world in thrall of religious and other cultural norms on childbearing, this has probably got to be the stupidest and most impractical solution for sealing the leaking dam.

[SeaGypsy]

What is worse is back in the 70's most people didn't even NEED a college degree to find a livable wage job......

I don't have a degree yet I make more on wages than most people on this site, I also flogged the competition first go on last year's oil pricewatch. This is because I think outside the box.
To me you seem to have a stack of boxes with no coherent understanding of how they fit together.

[americandream]

An high net worth investor who has grown accustomed to a return of 10% minimum on his investment is not going to forego this for a steady state 2% in order to secure the system that grants him that return. Gluttony and stupidity is the name of the game with these cretins and they will be equally as surprised as all the other dolts are when collapse ensues.

WTF do you invest in then mister ethical communist investor? Rangoon uniform factories?

Aaahhh. Just playing Devil's advocate yunno. I would rather attack useless eating capitalists than Jews however.

[Hawkcreek]

Not perfectly logical to me. There should be no need to kill the old if you don't allow them any advanced healthcare. The ones who live, in spite of the lack of care, might contribute something to the group.
In other words if you implement # 5, you don't need # 4.

[Ludi]

6. Create self-perpetuating and self-sustaining robots and ai and electronic automation systems that produce much of the food, and necessities of survival for mankind in an automated set-and-forget kind of way that only requires minimum supervision and the occasional high level overseeing...

Sort of like the Venus Project, but with killing old people.

http://www.thevenusproject.com/

[SeaGypsy]

Read the other blatherings of TEOTWAWKI? He reminds me of William Buroughs 'Cut Up' technique.

[mos6507]

4. Mandatory euthanasia at age ~55. Make this the global age limit cap for citizens and population.

5. Cease all advanced health-care treatments (reserve them only for the elite) this is not so much to save money and resources as it is to let nature take its course, and put evolution

.....

Congratulations! You win the honour of being labelled by me as the biggest idiot ever on this site!
Your prize, if you wish to collect it, is a sock in the kisser!

Jerk. OMG!

Monte's cut the cord meme lives! This guy fearmongers about the evil NWO in one breath, denies he's doing it, and then agrees that we need a genocide on the other. He really doesn't know whether he's coming or going. Shades of the AZ shooter as far as confused ideologies go, IMHO.

[mos6507]

6. Create self-perpetuating and self-sustaining robots and ai and electronic automation systems that produce much of the food, and necessities of survival for mankind in an automated set-and-forget kind of way that only requires minimum supervision and the occasional high level overseeing...

Sort of like the Venus Project, but with killing old people.

http://www.thevenusproject.com/

Reminds me of this:

[Ludi]

Reminds me of this:

Definitely fictional.

And I worry that I'm not sufficiently attached to reality!

[teotwawki]

Not perfectly logical to me. There should be no need to kill the old if you don't allow them any advanced healthcare. The ones who live, in spite of the lack of care, might contribute something to the group.
In other words if you implement # 5, you don't need # 4.

I'm not saying exceptions can't or shouldn't be made to the ones that are actually a contributor to the group. But in an ever shrinking world (one that is diametrically opposite of our "perpetual infinite growth machine") there will be less and less need for these "contributions"...

#5 and #4 are not entirely the same. Advanced healthcare treatments are not entirely exclusive for the elderly. Prior to condoms and contraceptives people had natural unprotected sex all the time and yet the population never exploded like it did until in modern times. This is due to there being more food (agricultural revolution), much higher standards of living (in part thanks to technology and computing) and also better medicine and health-care practices. Several hundred years ago just making it past the age of "five" was considered by then standards as a "milestone".. I am saying we still think in terms of "equality of life" but alas mother nature will beg to differ. So we overindulge in excess consumption (that we no longer have and can not anymore afford) to prop up our dysfunctional notions and delusions of grandiose of life, (as if life was a 'right', or that 'rights' actually exists outside of the artificial social construct or legal notion of rights/duties, etc) and then wonder why there is less and less remaining pie..

Using the same arguments that capitalism is better than communism or socialism, one can see that pure capitalism is a self-similar subset of evolution itself. The reason "capitalism" has triumphed over communism/socialism is an evolutionary one. The "invisible hand of adam smith" might as well be called "natural selection"..

I think you are correct to say that as resources continue to dwindle there will be placed upon us all these structural bounds that will naturally constrain and cap our options on all levels. When couples can no longer afford to have children, they don't need an artificial "law" or mandate prohibiting them from doing so. When old people find out their IRA/401K/Pension funds/etc was just fictitious monies and never actually existed (in terms of resources allocated to back up those valuations) in the first place, and they can't afford health-care, the problem will largely take care of itself.

So yes in a sense much of the aforementioned above will likely happen in one form or another whether we like it or not. And this is perhaps by TPTB appears to have its head in the sand and not taking any real action. Perhaps they feel in due time mother nature and evolutionary forces and demand destruction will best "optimize" the shutdown.....

[teotwawki]

What is worse is back in the 70's most people didn't even NEED a college degree to find a livable wage job......

I don't have a degree yet I make more on wages than most people on this site, I also flogged the competition first go on last year's oil pricewatch. This is because I think outside the box.
To me you seem to have a stack of boxes with no coherent understanding of how they fit together.

What you were or were not able to achieve as an individual does not speak for the broader averages and aggregate totalities. That you were able to flog the competition first go on last year's oil pricewatch is meaningless and irrelevant to the topic on hand. The fact remains that due to globalization and the inherent pressures of competition (domestic laborers competing against those "cheaper" workers of other nations and workers competing with - and often displaced or made obsolete by - technology itself) a higher education has become more and more necessary, the sentiment these days is that a college degree is a birthright almost, and yet even with these additional skill-sets it is harder than ever before (due to lack of jobs in the markets, and the natural downward pressure of wages inflicted by so many in need of a job) to make a real livable wage.

[davep]

Prior to condoms and contraceptives people had natural unprotected sex all the time and yet the population never exploded like it did until in modern times. This is due to there being more food (agricultural revolution), much higher standards of living (in part thanks to technology and computing) and also better medicine and health-care practices.

That's a strange argument. The countries with modern agriculture, higher standards of living and better health care are the ones with the lowest per-capita birth rates. Europe's population is set to fall over the next 40 years, for example.

[teotwawki]

4. Mandatory euthanasia at age ~55. Make this the global age limit cap for citizens and population.

5. Cease all advanced health-care treatments (reserve them only for the elite) this is not so much to save money and resources as it is to let nature take its course, and put evolution

.....

Congratulations! You win the honour of being labelled by me as the biggest idiot ever on this site!
Your prize, if you wish to collect it, is a sock in the kisser!

Jerk. OMG!

Monte's cut the cord meme lives! This guy fearmongers about the evil NWO in one breath, denies he's doing it, and then agrees that we need a genocide on the other. He really doesn't know whether he's coming or going. Shades of the AZ shooter as far as confused ideologies go, IMHO.

So you would consider what happened on Easter Island as a genocide? Our ability to have distinct categorical-perception thresholds of qualitative experiential phenomenon is what gives way to the need and compulsion to adopt the use of something akin to a Lexical Hypothesis in terms of creating labels and their resultant definitional boundaries. While language exists as a means of convenient placeholder and pointer to internal subjective neural-correlates-of-consciousness, it is nonetheless a reductive and inherently translative approach that cannot possibly yield direct mappings to the 'real world'.. Categorization is cognition, we see repeated phenomenon and enough instances to sort out a pattern, then put a label to it.. the only problem is when you try to work backwards and assume that empirical reality itself could also conform to such inaccurate labellings and boundaries.

Are we to make the distinction between natural and artificial? Anything that man does is deemed 'artificial' whilst everything that all other animals do are "natural"? So once you conjure up this concept of genocide (which only exists in a very narrow context and subset of life on earth) and try to misapply it... well... there is your "confused ideology" for you.

[teotwawki]

Prior to condoms and contraceptives people had natural unprotected sex all the time and yet the population never exploded like it did until in modern times. This is due to there being more food (agricultural revolution), much higher standards of living (in part thanks to technology and computing) and also better medicine and health-care practices.

That's a strange argument. The countries with modern agriculture, higher standards of living and better health care are the ones with the lowest per-capita birth rates. Europe's population is set to fall over the next 40 years, for example.

In terms of raw nominal numbers you are correct. However, from a per-capita energy consumption standpoint the Western nation's "birth rate" is comparatively speaking much higher than that of the rest of the "third world".. For example, a single child in America on average consumes 16 times the energy and resources of the average Indian child.. So the anecdotal 2.5 kids is more or less like an Indian family of 40..