[LaLaLand]

I wanted to run an issue past this forum. The SO and I are looking for a house. We found one, but it has a possible severe flaw. We are trying to gauge the risk of this flaw.

The house is known to have lead based paint.

A few facts:

A professional tester performed the test that found the lead based paint.

Wisconsin regulates lead based paint tests and the professionals who perform the tests.

In Wisconsin, once a house is known to have lead based paint, the owner at the time of the finding is required to notify all future potential buyers and tenants that the house contains lead based paint. Also, all owners of the property must continually notify all future potential buyers and tenants that lead based paint was found.

The levels of the findings were deemed below hazardous levels.

The present owners used recommended methods to treat the issue. The issue was last treated in 2003.

A few thoughts:

We are unsure at this time if the state keeps records of all called upon lead based paint tests and tests that find lead based paint. We are looking into this.

The area of the city we are looking in has a lot of housing stock that was built between the 1940s – 1970s. A lot of lead based paint was used in this era. Basically, the probability of finding lead based paint in this area of the city is at least 50% (that is if it is searched for to begin with). Of course there is a difference between knowing that a house has lead based paint and keeping it private or not knowing and being comfortable with it vs. calling for a professional test (again, this is a state regulated profession) and finding out lead based paint is on site, at which time it becomes record, a paper trail.

We know that if a house is known to have lead based paint, any person or contractor used for a remodel must be 'lead based paint certified.' We are unsure if this means all DIY remodeling is off the table unless we become certified, which would become recorded by the state.

Our bottom line concerns:

This house has a paper trail.

Anti lead based paint is a politicized and well publicized cause, it's a known legal detriment, and known health hazard. IE it scares people. Scary is a value killer to some. We wonder if this situation is scary enough to reduce the value of this home now as well as future re-sales?

According to what we have read so far, it seems lead based paint is a permanent contaminant. Once it's at a place, it will be there forever. It comes down to how well people can limit their exposure to it. We wonder how scary others will perceive this situation even if we were to do our best to re-treat the issue?

Have any of you dealt with this issue before?

[z28colt]

The house I bought last year was built in 1970, and the seller was obligated to give me some paperwork about lead based paint due to the build date. I was quiet concerned about the possible health effects at first, but after researching it and talking to company that performs lead based testing, I decided that it wasn't much of a concern as long as you take some basic precautions.
However, my house has never been officially tested, and I have heard of the law that was recently passed about certified contractors. Those issues might cause some extra costs on your part for any remodeling. Have you talked to the company that did the testing? You should be able to call some of those testing companies in your area to get more information. Even a couple hundred dollars for time with an attorney may be worth the legal advice.
As far as the value of the house, I would guess that it would not be much affected, given that the proper steps were taken, and that the house doesn't have paint chipping. For example, I have two young kids and was still willing to purchase a house that likely has lead paint after doing some research. Our next door neighbor is a doctor with four kids, and bought a house built at the same time. Any adults looking at the house shouldn't be bothered, as they won't be chewing on the paint our playing on the floor, then licking their hands.
You can also knock a bit off the asking price, noting the concern.

[Pops]

Pretty well any house built before '70-something has lead and or asbestos containing materials. If your house has had any professional abatement at all it's probably better off than most.

I wouldn't worry about the legal stuff that much.

If the paint is failing I'd have the seller fix it.

If I had little kids I would at least paint over any paint that looks chalky and maybe use paint stripper on any woodwork that might get chewed.

[basil_hayden]

Homeowners aren't regulated, professionals are.

Use a drop cloth to catch chips so they don't end up in your garden soil.

Built before 1978 implies lead based paint (LBP).

It's a management issue - encapsulation, monitoring and repair when necessary.

Asbestos is the same way - but if you think there's no asbestos in today's building materials, you'd be very wrong despite it being outlawed. If the material is not friable, it's not getting airborne so it's not a health issue. Tiles, the mastic, pipe wrap, and even in paint (the good exterior type that lasts a long time).

Want to worry more? PCBs in caulk is also a common issue, but usually in commercial buildings, as the best, longest lasting caulk such as a marine grade caulk happens to have the highest PCB concentration. PCBs leach out of the caulk and into adjacent building materials as well as into the surficial soils.

Give environmental consultants a few more years and they'll find another common building material substance to chase.

[Ferretlover]

Wisconsin house? Houses built before 1978 may have radon (ours in Chippewa Falls did).

If you really want the house, bid according to the problem, perhaps adding a bit to your loan to deal with the problems, and get to work.

[LaLaLand]

Yea. Industry, and its associated chemicals/spinning blades/sharp edges/huge machines that can easily crush humans, has as many dangers as it does productive advantages. Capitalism kills and maims as much as it extends life, I get that, I'll never argue with that.

Lead based paint is all over the place. Truth... What can one really do? Make more safety crap and regulations to pile onto the safety crap and regulations already there? Obviously they never got rid of the underlying poison to begin with. Its there, its never going to go away. I totally agree.

But, this house has a paper trail vs. assumptions and guesses. Basically, instead of the lead paint 'possibility' paperwork all sellers of houses built before 1978 are required to disclose to all potential buyers, this seller has to go a step further because its known its there. It's that step further that I think adds to the scare factor, for some people anyway.

Of course we are going to use this as leverage. We are simply trying to gauge how much leverage we actually have considering lead based paint is probably all over the area where we are looking for houses to begin with.

[Fishman]

Agree with Pops, paint over it, actualy works well. Don't eat it.
As to the comment

Capitalism kills and maims as much as it extends life

seems other systems do as bad or worse, had your town decimated by anthrax like the Soviets lately? Had your environment destroyed like the Chicoms?

[Pops]

had your town decimated by anthrax like the Soviets lately?

Lead and capitalists' externalizing costs go hand - what a segway!

Pitcher OK was a lead town and the US taxpayer has spent several hundreds of millions cleaning it up, I think Tar Creek is the largest Superfund site.

Back in the good old days they didn't have any of those pesky environmental regulations that kill business profits. That's what-cha call Free Enterprise.




http://www.wired.com/magazine/2010/08/ff_madmaxtown/

[Shaved Monkey]

lead makes children stupid so it was probably an important part of the social engineering

[basil_hayden]

lead makes children stupid so it was probably an important part of the social engineering

Nah, it just kills things real good; so along with chromium, cadmium and arsenic, paint with this stuff lasts a long time on a typical exterior.

Now we'll have to paint more often and the statistic for middle-aged and old gentlemen falling off ladders will increase.

Speaking as one of them, probably the way it should be.

[LaLaLand]

Thanks everyone. I appreciate your responses.