Newfie wrote:OF we could just learn to live with what Nature provides.
Newfie wrote:We WILL learn to live with less, either by way of thoughtful planning but more likely because we will eventually have less.
Re: west coast power. Less is coming because the climate there is reverting to a dryer cycle. California can either build more nuclear plants (earthquakes), import power from other areas (build nukes elsewhere), or reduce consumption. Hard to do when you want to ban ICE’s. The current trend seems to be to reduce consumption by depopulation.
Newfie wrote:OF we could just learn to live with what Nature provides.
theluckycountry wrote:Newfie wrote:OF we could just learn to live with what Nature provides.
Which primitive civilizations have done for millennia. And when population outgrew what Nature provided, the civilizations collapsed, the people move to other places.
Simply cutting back on water usage won't be enough. So much is used for farming and sanitary purposes that when the dams and aquifers fail the major cities will have to be abandoned. Unless of course you use the last of the resources to build a string of nuclear stations to desalinate the ocean.
A nuclear plant to desalinate sea water might be cheaper for a coastal location then transporting water from far away but those locations in need tend to be arid locations so have plenty of sunlight to power desalination facilities.
vtsnowedin wrote:Old poorly written agreements be dammed, they will soon have to reallocate what water actually flows in as fairly as possible.
I would think that waste water from the coastal cities could be transported inland for treatment and reuse as irrigation water rather then discharging it to the sea. The level of treatment would of course be dependent on the crop being grown as I would not want even highly treated sewage water watering my carrots or lettuce. Nut trees and feed for livestock could use it and reserve the cleanest water for truck garden crops.
Alfred Tennyson wrote:We are not now that strength which in old days
Moved earth and heaven, that which we are, we are;
One equal temper of heroic hearts,
Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.
Tanada wrote:vtsnowedin wrote:Old poorly written agreements be dammed, they will soon have to reallocate what water actually flows in as fairly as possible.
I would think that waste water from the coastal cities could be transported inland for treatment and reuse as irrigation water rather then discharging it to the sea. The level of treatment would of course be dependent on the crop being grown as I would not want even highly treated sewage water watering my carrots or lettuce. Nut trees and feed for livestock could use it and reserve the cleanest water for truck garden crops.
For a decade or so Singapore has been reclaiming their waste water to a growing percentage. It goes through all the regular sewage treatment steps, then they purify it to environmental discharge standards and store it in a huge artificial reservoir they created by putting a dam across the entrance to a large bay. Water pulled out of the bay filled with reclaimed water is sent through the regular potable water treatment plant and blended with all their other sources including rain catchment and water they buy from the mainland by treaty from a nearby river. The fact that cities like Los Angeles have arranged their storm water system to discharge fresh rainwater strait down a concrete lined river bed into the Pacific Ocean has always been one of my top ten examples of stupid people doing stupid things. Capturing all that rainwater that is infrequent but heavy when it falls and pumping it into reservoirs would be energy expensive but compared to desalinating seawater or pumping water all the way from Hoover Dam over mountains make it seem like a pretty small ask when it comes to energy use.
NEWater Singapore
vtsnowedin wrote:Old poorly written agreements be dammed, they will soon have to reallocate what water actually flows in as fairly as possible.
I would think that waste water from the coastal cities could be transported inland for treatment and reuse as irrigation water rather then discharging it to the sea. The level of treatment would of course be dependent on the crop being grown as I would not want even highly treated sewage water watering my carrots or lettuce. Nut trees and feed for livestock could use it and reserve the cleanest water for truck garden crops.
You are probably right about the water war but I would not call 100 gallons per day per person times the population of southern California inconsequential. Agricultural use is however measured by the acre foot so in comparison much larger. (1 acre foot = 326,700 gallons of water.). If your farmland has been cut off from all irrigation water a six inch pipeline of treated waste water would be a Godsend. Over a 90 day growing season a crop like corn uses about two acre feet of water per acre of ground planted. That is just five gallons a minute 24/7.MonteQuest wrote:vtsnowedin wrote:Old poorly written agreements be dammed, they will soon have to reallocate what water actually flows in as fairly as possible.
I would think that waste water from the coastal cities could be transported inland for treatment and reuse as irrigation water rather then discharging it to the sea. The level of treatment would of course be dependent on the crop being grown as I would not want even highly treated sewage water watering my carrots or lettuce. Nut trees and feed for livestock could use it and reserve the cleanest water for truck garden crops.
Wastewater is so small as to be inconsequential and cost-prohibitive. A huge water war awaits.
vtsnowedin wrote:Those incinerating toilets work well enough for a single family or a remote location but would not work in say an apartment house or office building.
Way back when I was knee high to a grasshopper I saw a design for a solar desalination plant. It consisted of long trenches or concrete troughs built on the level about six feet wide with a plastic dome cap over them enough wider to set on a foundation wall that had a small trough along each side. Sunlight coming in evaporated the sea water in the center trench which condensed on the under side of the plastic dome tunnel and ran down and collected in the smaller side trenches. I don't know how many gallons per acre of dome you could get in a desert situation but other then pumping the sea water in and the fresh water out the other end it was energy free. Aren't there some pretty dry desert areas on the west side of the mountains around San Diego?
Alfred Tennyson wrote:We are not now that strength which in old days
Moved earth and heaven, that which we are, we are;
One equal temper of heroic hearts,
Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.
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