[Plantagenet]

Obama gave a press conference today where he once again promised with pinkies locked that he will cut government spending ----- just not yet


Obama wants another trillion+ in debt but no spending cuts. Given that his fiscal cliff bill wound up adding 4 trillion to the debt it's no surprise he wants still another trillion in debt now

The man is a human debt machine

[PrestonSturges]

Obama gave a press conference today where he once again promised with pinkies locked that he will cut government spending ----- just not yet

Obama wants another trillion+ in debt but no spending cuts. Given that his fiscal cliff bill wound up adding 4 trillion to the debt it's no surprise he wants still another trillion in debt now

The man is a human debt machine

fwap fwap fwap fwap fwap fwap

[Beery1]

The result of the "fiscal cliff" is going to be EU-style AUSTERITY by another name...

Gosh...what happened to Obama's iron-clad campaign promise to not raise gasoline taxes----the promise not to raise gas taxes seems to have disappeared. Now the BOers only say "no comment" when asked if they will be raising gasoline taxes...

Looks like we are going over the fiscal cliff----The republicans say they are ready to raise taxes but there is no sign of compromise from Obama and his fellow liberals on cutting spending...

IMHO Obama will screw up the FISCAL CLIFF negotiations in exactly the same way he screwed up the GRAND BARGAIN last year--Obama is so arrogant that he can't stand to negotiate or make a compromise. Buckle up your seatbelts...

Good bye Bush tax cuts. Obama is taking us over the fiscal cliff...

...Obama is only pretending to negotiate, and all the while fully intends to take us over the fiscal cliff...

Obama designed his plan to be unacceptable to Congress, because Obama wants to go over the fiscal cliff.

Were gasoline taxes raised? No. Did we go over the fiscal cliff? No. None of Planty's predictions came true.

So now that Planty's armageddon scenario didn't play out in terms of the fiscal cliff, he's dropped that - completely forgotten - in favor of his next Obama conspiracy theory. Step right up, get your tickets here for the show. It's the Debt Ceiling! Presented to you in Cinemascope by Planty!

I am Jack's total lack of surprise.

How can Planty be wrong all the time, yet it doesn't even cross his mind that maybe, just maybe, he's full of BS?

[Shaved Monkey]

Its not like its real money print some more if TSHTF print it in another colour

[Plantagenet]

The result of the "fiscal cliff" is going to be EU-style AUSTERITY by another name...

None of Planty's predictions came true.

Don't be silly Beery---Of course my predictions came true.

Income taxes were raised on the rich and payroll taxes were raised on the poor and working class, just as I predicted. Tax increases are a big part of what EU-style austerity is all about.

As far as the spending cuts in the fiscal cliff, they weren't fixed---they were just postponed for two months. The spending cuts of the fiscal cliff are still set to occur.

The current "debt limit" crisis in the US has obvious similarities to the "debt crises" in Greece or Spain that resulted in austerity----the US budget is wildly out of whack, and this is producing austerity in the USA---i.e. tax increases and budget cuts.

The debt limit crisis, like the fiscal cliff crisis, is just another step down the road to fiscal disaster and austerity that Obama put the US on when he exploded deficit spending in 2009, adding five trillion to the US debt so far.


Obama is a human debt machine

[Kez]

I don't really see the Debt Limit issue as Obama's fault, but he isn't changing the system either. The idea of going in debt and letting your successors figure out how to pay it off has been going on for a long time. Romney's own budget projections still had a budget deficit in 2020. Bush's budget team of geniuses used the massive upswing during the dot com boom era to base their future projections on, which no basic accountant working for a credible company would ever do. You have to assume their will be dips, hurricanes, scandals, bubbles that burst, pandemics, a San Francisco earthquake that is due, a massive solar flare, and even, dare say it, wars and terrorists attacks.

No one at the federal level that I know of is concerned with truly solving money problems, they are just trying to get their share and keep their people/state happy. I have heard and read numerous stories of departments wasting vast amounts of cash buying junk because if they didn't spend it, they wouldn't get the cash included for next year's budget. The same is true of congressman, they pile on pork in even the Sandy hurricane bill to throw their own state a bone. As long as the $42 billion per month trade deficit continues, the USA is just bleeding cash and kicking the can down the road. Everyone knows that individuals and companies cannot continue like that forever. One day, bankruptcy will come for the USA also. How it will be handled is anyone's guess, but it won't be pretty.

The system is simply broken and only a full-blown default will "fix" it. In the end, whether it is next week or decades from now, the citizens (and the whole world in general) will be screwed and will suffer greatly. It will be complete madness and I suspect thousands upon thousands will die in the resulting chaos, especially if it occurs near other inevitable events like oil shortages, medicare/social security having no cash, or a well-planned terrorist attack.

[Plantagenet]

I don't really see the Debt Limit issue as Obama's fault.... The idea of going in debt and letting your successors figure out how to pay it off has been going on for a long time.

Obama lied in 2008 when he promised to cut the deficit in half---he tripled it instead.

Obama lied in 2012 when he promised a "balanced" approach to cutting the deficit---His fiscal cliff bill increased taxes on every working Americans and had so many special tax deals in it for his cronies (do you really support tax breaks for Hollywood billionaires---come on) that it actually adds another 4 trillion to the debt.

If you aren't willing to criticize a politician like Obama when he has clearly lied about the budget deficit issue, then how do you ever expect to get honest politicians or a competent goverment?


Obama is a human deficit machine

[Fishman]

Actually I will have to disagree with you somewhat Plant. Countries that have achieved the incredible amount of debt exceeding their gdp have only two choices. They can cut back spending which leads to folks in the street complaining, rioting, or they can monetize their debt until the money is worthless, at which point chaos. Greece was forced to go the first route since its in the Euro and cannot monetize its debt, thus austerity. We chose to go the route of monetizing our debt back in November. And who can you blame other than Obama? He added 6 to almost 7 trillion of debt over just 4 years. Many folks voted for him thinking their checks from the gov would keep on coming, and they will. As the economy stagnates, more unemployed will be added, disability applicants exceeding jobs over and over. Little did they know that those checks will be getting smaller and smaller in value. Folks love free stuff, till its worthless.

[Plantagenet]

....We chose to go the route of monetizing our debt back in November. And who can you blame other than Obama? He added 6 to almost 7 trillion of debt over just 4 years. Many folks voted for him thinking their checks from the gov would keep on coming, and they will. As the economy stagnates, more unemployed will be added, disability applicants exceeding jobs over and over. Little did they know that those checks will be getting smaller and smaller in value. Folks love free stuff, till its worthless.

+1

Yup.

Thats exactly the road we are on.

[Blacksmith]

It's a road we just have to travel until the bitter end. Our children will ask how we could have been so stupid and selfish and the answer is because we are human.

[Beery1]

... We chose to go the route of monetizing our debt back in November. And who can you blame other than Obama? He added 6 to almost 7 trillion of debt over just 4 years...

And I suppose you'd argue that two Republican wars had absolutely nothing to do with that.

[Plantagenet]

Obama...added 6 to almost 7 trillion of debt over just 4 years...

And I suppose you'd argue that two Republican wars had absolutely nothing to do with that.

The claim that Obama's creation of 6-7 Trillion dollars in debt in his first term is due to "two Republican wars" is silly.

The Iraq war ended in mid 2009---clearly it had a small effect on Obama's 1.6 trillion deficit in 2009, but had nothing to do with the trillion dollar deficits Obama has produced every subsequent year of his term.

And Obama himself is responsible for escalating the Afghanistan war and exploding spending there. When Obama took office in Janaury 2009 Afghanistan was a fairly quiet backwater with 30,000 US troops based mainly in Kabul. Obama declared Afghanistan was a "good war" and proceeded to triple the US force there to 100,000 with orders to surge into the countryside. Obama's policy inevitably resulted in a huge increase in the number of US military casualties so that now over 2000 US soldiers have died in Afghanistan. Obama and the dems simultaneously greatly increased non-military spending in Afghanistan on infrastructure and aid to the Karzai regime. Four years later its clear that Obama's efforts in Afghanistan have failed. After wasting ca. two thousand US lives and 1.2 trillion dollars so far, Obama finally set the US troop pullout for 2014----six years after he foolishly decided to escalate the war in Afghanistan.

What have Obama and the dems accomplished during the last four years of their war in Afghanistan other than a tragic waste of US lives and treasure? The Obama policy of escalating the war and channeling hundreds of billions of dollars to the corrupt Karzai regime in the name of "democracy" has clearly been a huge mistake that has accomplished nothing except to compound Obama's huge annual deficit spending problem.

[Blacksmith]

A sword or a plowshare, both use energy and resources. In other words stop blaming others and start plowing.

[Fishman]

Well Beery, the Iraq war comes in at 810 billion just a few seconds ago when I checked, though LOTS of Dems voted for it, I'll give that one to Republicans. The Afgan war, Dems get half the cost. Neither even come CLOSE to 6 trillion that Obama( oops sorry, calling him that is now racist per MSNBC) has racked up over 4 years. The president has said math is not his best point, apparently his defenders are also.

Lets suppose Obama's argument we should redistribute the wealth is correct. If we taxed ALL the income of millionaires up, about $290 billion a year. But a trillion dollar debt yearly means at some point austerity, inflation or chaos will crush the poor. Math Beery, Math and basic economics.

[Plantagenet]

“Increasing America’s debt weakens us domestically and internationally. Leadership means that ‘the buck stops here.’ Instead, Washington is shifting the burden of bad choices today onto the backs of our children and grandchildren. America has a debt problem and a failure of leadership. Americans deserve better. I therefore intend to oppose the effort to increase America’s debt limit.”
---Barack Obama (2006)

Unfortunately, the failure of leadership that Obama decried in 2006 has gotten even worse under Obama himself, who is by far the greatest wastrel in the history of the world.

[mmasters]

There is no real debt limit, it's just a number proposed by congress.

[Beery1]

Well Beery, the Iraq war comes in at 810 billion...

So you agree that it had something to do with it. How about the fact that the economy was in freefall before Obama took office?

[Plantagenet]

How about the fact that the economy was in freefall before Obama took office?

The recession ended years ago--- in May 2009. Nonetheless Obama ---the human debt machine--- churns out a trillion dollars in debt every year.

Why not face facts---Obama lied in 2006 when he spoke out against debt, and he lied in 2008 when he promised to cut the deficit in half, and he lied in 2012 when he again promised to cut the deficit using balanced tax increases and spending cuts. Obama has instead exploded deficit spending during his time in office---and that is why we are now 17 TRILLION in debt and up against the debt limit once again.

[Lore]

The US debt is not only a reflection of out of control spending and the lack of required revenue, but also changes in aging demographics, resource constraints, automation and globalization of labor.

Arguing about who gets the blame is meaningless to the endemic transformations that are taking place.

[Plantagenet]

The US debt ....Arguing about who gets the blame is meaningless to the endemic transformations that are taking place.

??

Obviously the people in charge get the blame.

Right now Obama is the president and so he gets the lion's share of the blame for the huge deficits that are occurring on his watch due to his policies and his feckless spending. An unfortunate part of Obama's legacy will be the 7 TRILLION dollars in debt his administration has created so far---it will be a drag on US economic growth, and on job creation and income levels for Americans for decades to come