[Sixstrings]

Some emails that have come out:

“The US army is the biggest joke the world has to laugh at,” wrote Sergeant Bergdahl in an email later published by Rolling Stone magazine. “[b]It is the army of liars, backstabbers, fools, and bullies[/b]. The few good SGTs [sergeants] are getting out as soon as they can, and they are telling us privates to do the same.”

...

Sgt Bergdahl had taken seriously the counter-insurgency strategy supposedly aimed at winning the “hearts and minds” of Afghans. Instead, he found that US soldiers regarded Afghans with aggressive contempt: “I am sorry for everything here. These people need help, yet what they get is the most conceited country in the world telling them that they are nothing and that they are stupid, that they have no idea how to live.”

He spoke of seeing an Afghan child run over by an American heavy-armoured truck, an event which his parents believe may have led him to leave his base. His father responded to his last message with an email in which the subject line was titled: “Obey Your Conscience.”
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/bergdahls-emails-reveal-extent-of-us-failure-9474557.html

I've been following this one on TV news. It looks like he purposely walked away, one of his fellow soldiers was on TV saying that Bergdahl went to an afghan village to desert and was there for a while and eventually the Taliban picks him up.

So.... it's not even like the Taliban captured him. He walked right in, wandering around a village, leaving his gear behind, deserting (apparently).

His emails have been read on TV news, and what strikes me is how much it sounds like what you hear on this forum, and the whole "alternate media" / Russian "RT" / Iranian "Press TV" thinking that's so prevalent, and as I've posted before, has spread to many Americans.

Many Americans are, in fact, anti-American. This anti-American RT-style thinking is not good, not if you're a US soldier, it's like a Tokyo Rose and it's poison. You don't see Russian soldiers feeling guilty.

We really do have adversaries / enemies in the world, and they don't give a sh*t how anti-american you are, you're still the Great Satan to them -- maybe just because you wear blue jeans and listen to rock music, who knows. And look at Russians, they're all whipped up because we have gay rights.

I've tried to make this point, to Quinn and others before on this forum, that it's not going to help them to be "quisling," as Dor has put it.

There are some people that just have it out for us, and if a nuke goes off in this country one day then it's not going to matter who watched RT and who was fashionably anti-American and who wasn't. The threats are to us *all*, and they are always oppressive systems that are opposing the real freedoms we have here, that they don't want spreading to their people -- the free vote that we have and they do not, and the human rights we have and they do not.

The thing that all the US adversaries have in common is that they are totalitarian / repressive / theocratic / dictatorial systems, that are not democracies, and that they are all either terrorists or bullies, and they don't care much about human rights.

So what good did it do him? To sound like a Quinn on this forum? IT JUST GOT HIM CAUGHT AND HELD CAPTIVE FOR YEARS! For goodness sake.

Even the North Koreans are better than that. A few US soldiers walked to the other side in the 60s. At least the North Koreans treated them well. (they made them propaganda stars)

But not so with the Taliban. It didn't seem to help him, at all, that he agreed with them and sympathized with them.

War is always a big mess, was the same with Vietnam. But it's not going to go well for you to get in your head that the other side is right and you're wrong, and then you walk over and just get held prisoner for years and years and suffer.

I definitely feel for the guy, he has suffered a lot, he was just young and caught up in thinking that sounds like Russia Today, and he should have got himself out of the army rather than try to "go native" and walk off to them because apparently they didn't give a sh*t that he was so anti-US, it won him no favors.

It's really not even his fault -- it's all this "alternative media" / "RT" thinking that's seeped into everything over here, especially our younger people. Putin sure gets bang for his buck with RT. It has had an effect. I've noticed it over the years.

It's not good for soldiers to think too deeply, about things, while in the thick of it. They're not aware of the big picture or what the future holds, even though it's a horrible mess at the time.

Some big picture recent news about Afghanistan is actually positive. It looks like there is lasting change over there, for democracy.

There've been a lot of positive stories coming out of Afghanistan. Even something that seemed like an outrage, orphaned babies being given away on a game show on TV, was actually progress -- unwanted children used to be just abandoned, to die. So this Afghan TV show was actually about raising general awareness and changing people. They're making progress. Afghanistan was like, dark ages.

They have progressed. It wasn't all for naught. And it was always a just war -- 9/11 really happened, and it really was AQ that did it, and the Taliban really were harboring them and wouldn't stop it.

[Sixstrings]

Some more of his writings, reported by Foxnews:

“The future is too good to waste on lies,” Bergdahl wrote his parents. “And life is way too short to care for the damnation of others, as well as to spend helping fools with their ideas that are wrong. I have seen their ideas and I am ashamed to even be American. The horror of the self-righteous arrogance that they thrive in. It is all revolting.”

Bergdahl's father, Bob Bergdahl, who learned the Pashto language spoken in much of Afghanistan while his son was held hostage and chanted an Islamic prayer as he stood alongside President Obama for Saturday's Rose Garden announcement of the deal, wrote back to his son with a subject line in all capital letters: "OBEY YOUR CONSCIENCE!" That email, one of several between the Bergdahls revealed in a lengthy 2012 Rolling Stone report, was sent three days before the-then private first class left his post.

Fellow soldiers who remembered Bergdahl as an outsider who studied Rosetta Stone lessons in the native language and talked of hiking to China, told Fox News they believe Bergdahl is a deserter, an offense punishable by death in the military code of justice.

“Yes, I do believe he deserted, without a doubt in my mind,” Cody Full told Megyn Kelly Monday. “He did not serve the United States with honor. We all took an oath — he violated his oath when he deserted us and put other Americans in jeopardy.”

“I just don’t want to see him hailed as a hero and I just want him to face the consequences of his own actions and possibly face court martial for desertion.”
- Gerald Sutton, Army infantryman who served with Bergdahl
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/06/03/wartime-messages-to-parents-fellow-soldiers-reveal-troubled-bergdahl/

It's heartbreaking, this poor guy drank the Press TV / Russia Today / Libertarian / wacky far left / "alternative media" koolaid:

I have seen their ideas and I am ashamed to even be American. The horror of the self-righteous arrogance that they thrive in. It is all revolting.

It's wrong, and that thinking screwed that young man up and got him captured and held for years, and put the soldiers that looked for him in danger, and I saw on CNN one of his fellow soldiers said some died in searches for him (I don't know details on that). And ultimately, the US has put 5 Taliban combatants back in the field, in trade for him.

It's just sad.

He didn't understand what's important about democracy. And what's different about a place like America, where muslims and Christians, and Russian immigrants and Ukrainians, and native born anglo and latinos and all these different people live together, versus other places that are intolerant and xenophobic and oppressive.

It's sad, this pervasive anti-Americanism, and people are blind to why democracy matters and human rights matter, and why dictators and ayatollahs and mullahs oppose it: THEY DON'T WANT IT SPREADING TO THEIR PEOPLE TOO, because they want to keep control on their people.

If the American adversaries win, then that means a more oppressive world, these people are not for freedom and liberty and human rights, and I don't know why so few understand this. And here you have someone like Berghdal, just disgusted about America, wtf. It's better than the darn Taliban, hello? Jesus.

P.S. And another thing, Bergdahl talked about "revolting," but I'll tell you what's revolting: tyranny.

Whether it's a dictator or a religious theocrat, and it's antithetical to who we are as Americans. We are against oppression. Most of the religious theocracies in this world are *oppressive* and do all they can to hold people down and stop secular humanistic progress -- that means womens' rights, that means human rights that are like our constitutional rights.

Free speech. Free assembly.

You want to know the theocracies that are at least allowing change, slowly, but at least want to modernize? They're the ones that are US allies.

Enough of all this anti-americanism. WE ARE THE GOOD GUYS. And Canadians are too, and the Aussies, and Europeans, and Brits, and our common way of life. If somebody is enamored by dictatorship, then let them go to the other side, and I hope they get treated better than the Taliban did to Bergdahl.

[Beery1]

If you're pro-American, then you have to be for freedom of speech and freedom to criticize. If America is truly strong, it can withstand a little criticism. If it's weak, it will not be able to do so. America's weakness lies in those Americans who are so quick to stifle dissent, not in those who are willing to criticize America, because it's those who wish to stifle dissent who truly pose the greatest threat to freedom.

No one ever helped a system to become great by refusing to see what could be improved. The best way to destroy any system is for everyone involved to ignore its faults and insist that it's good enough as it is.

It's not good for soldiers to think too deeply, about things, while in the thick of it.

Well, the Uniform Code of Military Justice and US law disagrees with you.
 
Article 90 of the Uniform Code of Military Justice states that "An order requiring the performance of a military duty or act may be inferred to be lawful and it is disobeyed at the peril of the subordinate. This inference does not apply to a patently illegal order, such as one that directs the commission of a crime."  Thus the UCMJ clearly allows for legitimate disobedience of illegal orders and it requires soldiers to think for themselves.  This comes from the so-called 'Principle of Nuremberg'
 
After World War II, Nazi war crimes were prosecuted at Nuremberg, and those trials established an important principle: that it is the responsibility of every individual to make an independent determination of the legality of any law or official act. No one may delegate that duty to others, not to superiors, and not to judges. It is no defense for soldiers to claim that they were "just following orders".
 
The point is this: Soldiers not only have the right to disobey an illegal order, but it is their individual DUTY to think for themselves and be directed by their own consciences to disobey such orders.  If they do not disobey illegal orders, they are guilty of any crime inherent in following those orders.  If any act during war is judged to be a war crime under international law, soldiers participating in it are individually guilty of the crimes that lead from their participation in an illegal war - murder, civil rights abuses, etc.  Because the UN Charter is US law, protected by the US Constitution, they would presumably also be guilty of violating their military oath (they have not borne true allegiance to the Constitution).  Thus, not only might they be guilty of international war crimes, but also of crimes against the United States.

So soldiers are specifically required to think deeply about the situations they are faced with. That is their sworn duty under military code and US law. If they don't, they are traitors by definition.

You don't see Russian soldiers feeling guilty.

No, you don't. But that's not because they don't feel guilty - it's because Russia is governed by folks who think exactly as you do, and where dissent happens, it is effectively stifled. I think it's ironic that you appear to be in awe of the Russian government's ability to prevent the sort of dissent your posts here criticize. If you want to live in the sort of place where dissent is not allowed, you may want to move to Russia, or China, or North Korea, because the political systems in those countries uphold your views. To be a good citizen here in the US, you cannot possibly hold the views you seem to value.

If your views become common here, the US will undoubtedly turn into the sort of state that you claim to want to protect us against.

[PrestonSturges]

Remember Jessica Lynch who was captured in Iraq? When she was released we found out that every word of her story as it was told to us complete bullshit. Death of Pat Tillman? There were what four separate coverups of his friendly fire death?

[PrestonSturges]

http://littlegreenfootballs.com/ has a good history of how the right wing was demanding that the President move heaven and earth to get this guy back and how they were making him a martyr as recently as three months ago. Now the exact same outlets are demanding his scalp.

[PrestonSturges]

Also not legally a "deserter" because he was being held prisoner. For one hundred years US Army has been the most lenient army on people going AWOL, and the army that has hung the most soldiers for rape. That's just how we roll.

[Plantagenet]

Thanks for starting this thread, 6.

Its pretty clear that Obama suddenly took the Taliban's offer to free Bergdahl in exchange for their top five leaders at GITMO for purely political reasons---it was an attempt to move the VA scandal off the front pages.

The BO administration staged a Rose Garden press conference with the parents, and Susan Rice did her usual lying trip to the sunday new shows to proclaim that Bergdahl served with "honor and distinction" while Obama proclaimed him a "hero." Of course they knew he was a deserter, but since there isn't a single vet in the White House these days, they probably didn't even know what that means. I'm sure the BO people expected a frency of flag-waving and praise to accompany the release.

Well---they did indeed move the VA disgrace off the front pages---but not in the way they intended. This has pretty much blown up in the BO people's faces, politically speaking.


When will Obama invite the parents of the soldiers killed looking for Bergdahl after he deserted to come to the White House?

[PrestonSturges]

It's amusing to watch the convergence of Six's <strike>fascist tendencies</strike> saccharine ultra-nationalism and Plant's bitter Naderism. You can't buy entertainment like that!

[Plantagenet]

Six's fascist tendencies ...

????

There is no call for you to make nasty ad homs about Six.

Lets just discuss the topic.

[AgentR11]

First off, I wouldn't consider *ANYTHING* read or discussed publicly about this incident as fact at least until a year or so has past. There is no way Bergdahl can be considered competent to make any sort of statement or recollection of the events leading to his capture; and as a POW while in their custody, anything arising from that time is on the Taliban actors, not Bergdahl.

Secondly, that it is being used politically, so quickly,by either/both sides of our political spectrum is despicable. They should know better, and they should go to their graves bearing the shame and dishonor of what they are saying and writing now.

Investigate quietly, determine REAL facts, if real facts demand prosecution then do so, if real facts demand commendation then do so.

I also fear the politicization of the event may have greatly harmed the ability to find real fact.

That said, prisoner exchange is an ancient tradition of warfare. We declared war (in our mealy mouthed way) on Taliban Afghanistan. They have *NOT* surrendered. QED, seems legit enough to me. Seems legit enough that it really shouldn't even need the direction of the commander in chief...

nb... If I had my guess, I'd suspect he got depressed after seeing the child smushed, wandered off thoughtlessly, and got captured by a random dude with a pistol (or dudette, wouldn't that be embarrassing, burka-girl bags tearful US soldier with pretend finger-pistol). Very undramatic, very disappointing, fairly stupid. Not some grand gesture of defiance.

[PrestonSturges]

First off, I wouldn't consider *ANYTHING* read or discussed publicly about this incident as fact at least until a year or so has past. There is no way Bergdahl can be considered competent to make any sort of statement or recollection of the events leading to his capture; and as a POW while in their custody, anything arising from that time is on the Taliban actors, not Bergdahl.

Secondly, that it is being used politically, so quickly,by either/both sides of our political spectrum is despicable. They should know better, and they should go to their graves bearing the shame and dishonor of what they are saying and writing now.

Investigate quietly, determine REAL facts, if real facts demand prosecution then do so, if real facts demand commendation then do so.

I also fear the politicization of the event may have greatly harmed the ability to find real fact.

That said, prisoner exchange is an ancient tradition of warfare. We declared war (in our mealy mouthed way) on Taliban Afghanistan. They have *NOT* surrendered. QED, seems legit enough to me. Seems legit enough that it really shouldn't even need the direction of the commander in chief...

nb... If I had my guess, I'd suspect he got depressed after seeing the child smushed, wandered off thoughtlessly, and got captured by a random dude with a pistol (or dudette, wouldn't that be embarrassing, burka-girl bags tearful US soldier with pretend finger-pistol). Very undramatic, very disappointing, fairly stupid. Not some grand gesture of defiance.

I agree 100%, I just wasn't willing to put the effort into saying it.

And let's not forget John McCain cooperated with the North Vietnamese, but nobody suggested leaving him behind.

And of course, all we need to to make Bergdahl back into a hero of Fox News is give him a Gadsen flag and send him to the Bundy Ranch, because hating America is what Fox does best!

This really is the propaganda driven "DOUBLETHINK" that Orwell warned about as well as the "Two Minute Hate."

[Pops]

nb... If I had my guess, I'd suspect he got depressed after seeing the child smushed, wandered off thoughtlessly, and got captured by a random dude with a pistol (or dudette, wouldn't that be embarrassing, burka-girl bags tearful US soldier with pretend finger-pistol). Very undramatic, very disappointing, fairly stupid. Not some grand gesture of defiance.

LOL

I agree with your take 100% as well

[Sixstrings]

It's amusing to watch the convergence of Six's <strike>fascist tendencies</strike> saccharine ultra-nationalism and Plant's bitter Naderism. You can't buy entertainment like that!

Well, my roots are actually Tea Party type -- I was "tea party" before there was a tea party, and libertarian before anybody ever heard of a Ron Paul. Before Obama, I was a consistent Republican voter. One of those suburbanite Republican types. I listened to Limbaugh for years. (I'd never listen to him now, my understanding is too broad now. I hear his racial dog whistles and all of that and know them for what they are).

Sooo.. yeah, I'm a convert and came to Jesus and registered Democrat and vote Democrat, as you all know.

Don't call me a fascist, Preston. I'm AGAINST fascism.

That moment when they start curbing free speech and oppressing people, THAT'S when my stomach turns. The principle of free speech for all is more important than anything a fascist will promise you. Remember the words of Benjamin Franklin, if you trade your liberty for (fascist) strong man Putin security, then you deserve neither liberty nor security.

I can drift that way sometimes so I try to really watch it. I'm actually concerned about some immigration, same as all the other right wing are, ***we just don't want to see the whole country turn into Mexico Preston. Look at Texas -- the drug cartels are now putting up billboards like they do in Mexico, "Silver Over Lead," it's a warning to the cops to take the bribes or else.

So HOW DO YOU EXPRESS THESE CONCERNS, without go off into racist xenophobic jingo fascist land? It's a balance. Lefties ignore the problem entirely, whereas the Repub right wing goes too far.

Back to Berghdahl..

Republicans were making hay about this from the start, because we traded 5 combatants and they say it's like negotiating with terrorists. So my first impression was that R's ought to cool it there, everyone is glad we got this soldier back, even if they may be right that this will encourage more hostage taking.

But then.. all this other stuff came out.. It sounds like Bergdahl's father didn't help him much. "Follow your conscience," and then kid deserts off to a taliban village.

MY MAIN POINT with this thread, are, THE CONSEQUENCES of these hippy far left / libertarian (you all are both the same) "alternative media" / 9/11 was an inside job wing nuttery, and Russia Today / Iranian Press TV thinking.

AT SOME POINT WE HAVE TO STOP BEING ANTI AMERICAN AND STAND UP for our democracy and our constitutional rights and be proud of them. I sure believe in them, DON'T YOU ALL??? Free speech is so important. Don't you understand, a Talbian, a Putin, a communist China, are against this? And they are out to expand their way of doing things, in the world.

I'm just so sick of it, the brick wall ANTI AMERICANISM and too many Americans sounding like Russia Today and it's dangerous, as our liberty will be threatened in the future, and dictatorships and theocracies and caliphs are on the march.

Preston you call it sacharine, you say that because you take your rights for granted, but for the first time in my life I see democracy and these rights truly under threat as Putin and China lead the world another way.

Too many have been brainwashed with their Noam Chomsky books and if our democracy is threatened, they'll actually just go desert to the dictator / taliban! Incredible!

It's so pervasive on the far left. And it's pervasive among the Repub Libertarian wing. How many times has Ron Paul been on Russia Today tv? Way too many. Enough of it, now you've got soldiers deserting, they're all screwed up by this internet Russia Today type thinking, it's not good.

And this is after Snowden. Are these our future leaders? Jesus. What are they going to do, lead us all into captivity?

Let me tell you all something, we are the good guys, and these religious theocracies and communist China and Vladimir Putin are in opposition to our way of life -- they have a right to do things how they want, but as they expand then we must stand up to them, and as Putin and Iran spreads propaganda in the US, *somebody has to stand up now and then* and explain the obvious: that really, people in Russia and Iran actually want the same freedoms we have but they can't because their uprisings get squashed.

And that, really, women in Afghanistan are glad to have a vote and glad to begin to get out of the HORRIFIC dark ages they have been LIVING IN. What's Berghdal and Ron Paul and RT's opinion on that, eh? What, they don't give a sh*t?

Wake up, people, and don't be blind to what is good about the American Way -- women not getting treated like sh*t and slapped around and worse, and all our human rights.

It's bizarre that I have to defend the obvious -- what is GOOD about our Western way of life. It's modern. It's humanitarian. It's equal opportunity and a neutral government, and people being free, free to be muslim or Christian, or whatever, so long as we all respect each others' rights and no group oppresses another. That's the American Way, and why some of you don't believe in that is beyond me.

[Pops]

MY MAIN POINT with this thread, are, THE CONSEQUENCES of these hippy far left / libertarian (you all are both the same) "alternative media" / 9/11 was an inside job wing nuttery, and Russia Today / Iranian Press TV thinking.

It's pervasive on the far left. It's pervasive among the Repub Libertarian wing. How many times has Ron Paul been on Russia Today tv? Way too many. Enough of it, now you've got soldiers deserting, they're all screwed up by this internet Russia Today type thinking, it's not good.

And this is after Snowden. Are these our future leaders? Jesus. What are they going to do, lead us all into captivity?

Let me tell you all something, we are the good guys, and these religious theocracies and communist China and Vladimir Putin are in opposition to our way of life -- they have a right to do things how they want, but as they expand then we must stand up to them, and as Putin and Iran spreads propaganda in the US, *somebody has to stand up now and then* and explain the obvious: that really, people in Russia and Iran actually want the same freedoms we have but they can't because their uprisings get squashed.

That is a pretty funny rant except I don't have the foggiest notion of your point even after you tell me you are going to tell me your main point, LOL. You just ramble on ...

Make-a-Logical-Argument

1 - Know the premise.

2 - Decide how to construct a logical argument. You have 2 options.
• Syllogism uses 1 major premise, observation and conclusion.
• Inductive reasoning uses specific facts and moves to a general argument.

3 – Avoid logical fallacies.

[Sixstrings]

That is a pretty funny rant except I don't have the foggiest notion of your point even after you tell me you are going to tell me your main point, LOL. You just ramble on ...

Make-a-Logical-Argument

1 - Know the premise.

2 - Decide how to construct a logical argument. You have 2 options.
• Syllogism uses 1 major premise, observation and conclusion.
• Inductive reasoning uses specific facts and moves to a general argument.

3 – Avoid logical fallacies.

You're right, Pops, I get too out in the weeds seeing all sides of issues.

I'll make it simple.

The Noam Chomsky / Russia Today / Iranian Press TV thinking has gone too far. Pendulum has swung too far. People talk about "white guilt," well a real problem is "America guilt" and we need to wake up and remember what is special about this place and why it is worth keeping this flame alive, in the world, as caliphs and dictators would like a different future for humanity.

Is that clear enough?

I've just HAD IT. This Russia Today / internet / Noam Chomsky thinking, and the libertarians too (they're for constitutional rights yet go on Russia Today all the time so wtf), it's all GONE TOO FAR and the wing nuttery has become the mainstream and you've got a young soldier all screwed up and he walks over to the Taliban like an idiot.

My point is.. those of you who are so anti-American.. are just *not thinking* about what you're tearing down, and who that helps, and what oppressive and really bad systems will replace it. Ok?

[AgentR11]

6, we are the good guys, only in the sense that we define "good" as "like us"; and evil as "not like us." Especially in the context that you write. We've killed as much or more, maimed as much or more, stolen as much or more. We take what we want, by the power of life and death that we wield, and we do it for our pleasure, convenience, and comfort.

If you sell service in the US Armed Forces as a comic book adventure; then sure, there'll be desertions. (not saying Bergdahl is, btw) It is a professional fighting force used to project power and protect the interests of the United States. You don't become an arbiter of truth and justice by donning the uniform. You become a weapon to carry out the policy objectives of those who hold power in the government of the United States. One should not join unless they are comfortable with the ramifications of such a profession.

In my opinion, it is reckless clamoring such as your text exemplifies that leads to the kinds of 0//1 errors that we've recently experienced. We have to live with the Russians and the Chinese; they can not be intimidated, no more so than we can. Each has the ability to simply choose to end the world without our consent or cooperation. You can not treat them in the same manner you'd address NK or Iran or some petting dictatorship in the Americas. We aggressively tried to cripple Russia; they dodged the blow. Asking Russia to stand back in place and let us hit them is stupidity beyond comprehension. Understanding them as equals in ability to end the world, one has to accept that sometimes they will win a sparing match. Shrug it off, have a beer/vodka, and chill out. This BS lust for confront without yielding leads to only one result.. annihilation.

I'm not seeing "annihilation" in my list of things in the interest of the United States.

[Plantagenet]

prisoner exchange is an ancient tradition of warfare. We declared war (in our mealy mouthed way) on Taliban Afghanistan. They have *NOT* surrendered. QED, seems legit enough to me. Seems legit enough that it really shouldn't even need the direction of the commander in chief....

Of course. Normally our military would negotiate with their military or our diplomats would negotiate with their military to exchange prisioners. But his was different.

Obama suddenly inserted himself into the process, overrode the internal objections of US military, diplomatic, and spy agencies that this wasn't a good deal, and just ordered the release of the Taliban dream team---including a class A war criminal and the main Taliban co-conspirator with Osama bin Laden---for Bergdahl.

Why did Obama do this?

Isn't it obvious---Obama trotted out the parents and called all the news agencies and did a photo op in the Rose Garden to create a new story to drive the disgraceful VA hospital stories off the media.

Its ironic that now its all blown up in Obama's face.

Just today TIME magazine is reporting that the Taliban now say they will kidnap more US soldiers and other Americans to win the release of more people from Gitmo. Now that Obama has shown what a wimp he is, the Taliban are going to roll him again and again.

Lets get all our troops out of Afghanistan now---before Obama does something else stupid and puts even more people at risk.

[AgentR11]

blah blah, Obama is scum for politicizing this, just as the right side media is scum for politicizing it.
Now we all get to suffer an unending stream of stupid.

[Sixstrings]

6, we are the good guys, only in the sense that we define "good" as "like us"; and evil as "not like us." Especially in the context that you write.

People just don't know our history. That's right Agent, we are right, and our way of doing things is the best way, AND THIS IS WHAT WE WERE FOUNDED ON centuries ago.

This is who we are.

Jefferson, and all the founders, saw our way of life as being universal natural rights of man, applicable everywhere. And it goes back to John Locke before them, and the Age of Reason thinkers in France, and we refined it.

This is who we are. Our founders believed it, and I do too, that all men (people) are created equal and power is derived from we the people, and ultimately our creator if we want to believe in one, NOT a Pope and NOT a King or a dictator or a caliph or a mullah.

But we didn't war on Afghanistan to change them -- let's stop the wing nuttery. The taliban were already bad dudes. They were blowing up ancient buddhist sites. They were dark age HORRIBLE to women, and just hardcore bad news. But that was their business, but then, they were harboring AQ after 9/11 and they wouldn't help us so f*ck it that meant war and that's just how it is.

The fact we've done more to progress them than Alexander the Great or the Brits or the Russians ever did, is a plus for them, but it wasn't the reason for that war.

If you sell service in the US Armed Forces as a comic book adventure; then sure, there'll be desertions. ... One should not join unless they are comfortable with the ramifications of such a profession.

Preston says I'm "sacharine" patriotic. It's okay to take it for granted when it's not threatened, but we're at the point now that we've got to have some social studies / history in the schools again.

People are all mixed up by Russia Today and the internet and wing nuttery. They don't even believe the Apollo missions happened. And 9/11 was an inside job. On and on, enough. Russians believe in Russia, taliban believe in taliban, and Americans need to believe in America or they can go right on over to Russia or the Taliban if they want to.

They really ought to have some basic classes in boot camps, just about war in general, and how horrible it is and how you'll see things that are horrific and accidents happen and bad sh*t goes down but you can't let it demoralize you or lose your purpose.

Afghanistan is actually a BETTER place than it used to be, but a Bergdahl couldn't see that in the thick of it, he just saw some bad things and he went over the edge and got it in his head the taliban were the good guys. They sure showed him no favors, did they?

P.S. you know, actually, from what Berghdahl was writing at the time it sounds like the soldiers were being told we're there "to help" the Afghan people, etc. That is true, but not primary -- we definitely need some frickin' basic history and social studies in boot camp. Our soldiers need to know wtf America is and why it's important and what they are fighting for, and what a Russian would be fighting for (Putin), or a jihadi is fighting for.

This is important stuff. Our soldiers are kids and education is crap and they just don't know.

It would have been better if we were telling the troops that yes, we're going to help the Afghans, but we are there because they wouldn't stop harboring Al Quada it's that simple.

[Plantagenet]

Obama is scum for politicizing this....Now we all get to suffer an unending stream of stupid.

Don't worry....only two and half more years to go.