[Cog]

If it does, you have forgotten your youthful days of partying, exploratory sex, and just enjoying being young. At the university I attended, there were many shenanigans during those first weeks. Even back in the more prudish days of 1976-1980

Someday those frat boys will be fathers sending their daughters off to the university. They will probably not be as amused as they are now as young men.

I do think the picture had a nice touch by including mom's in their drop off point.

[Cog]

The women have their own greeting to arriving freshmen men.

[Sixstrings]

The university called it "sickening" and the fraternity national president said it's "reprehensible."

Administrators and students alike, were "shaken:"

The banners near the university in Norfolk, Va., since removed, have shaken students and administrators alike.

...

"Any fraternity member found to be responsible for this reprehensible display will be held accountable by the fraternity," Beacham added, according to NBC.

After news of the banners went viral, reports WTKR, the school sent a statement to the local station:

"Messages like the ones displayed yesterday by a few students on the balcony of their private residence are not and will not be tolerated. The moment University staff became aware of these banners, they worked to have them removed. At ODU, we foster a community of respect and dignity and these messages sickened us.

They are not representative of our 3,000 faculty and staff, 25,000 students and our 130,000 alumni. Ours is a community that works actively to promote bystander intervention and takes a stand denouncing violence against women."

...

"I am outraged about the offensive message directed toward women that was visible for a time on 43rd Street. Our students, campus community and alumni have been offended. While we constantly educate students, faculty and staff about sexual assault and sexual harassment, this incident confirms our collective efforts are still failing to register with some."
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2015/08/24/virginia-frat-suspended-old-dominion-university/32298193/

Am I offended?

I don't know.. I think there's far too much partying going on in general, in our universities. Cog, do you realize that in a place like South Korea the students work their fingers to the bone? From kindergarten, on up to uni? They have no fun at all, whatsoever.

So what is it about our American higher education system, that requires football teams and "fraternities" and "party schools" and the whole thing costs a hundred grand or more.

They don't do this in Europe, at all. In Europe, university is a serious thing and it's stressful and the students have to work hard.

We can't "make america great again" just by sitting around drunk, or high on weed, or being obnoxiously hyper masculine.

When I was that age, I worked a full time job and my focus was on my job and "college" was something I was doing on the side. I had no time for "fraternities."

[Cog]

I knew I would lure out the Beta Males, Social Justice Warriors, and the politically correct. Thanks for your contributions to this thread Sixstrings.

[Sixstrings]

They don't do this in Europe, at all. In Europe, university is a serious thing and it's stressful and the students have to work hard.

Too true Six. My son is about to start his third year masters course at Liverpool University in England. He's studying mechanical engineering and it's bloody hard work.

Gas

Are you aware of how things are in the US? It's not all like this, but, there is a thing about our state unis where they actually compete with each other for "party school" rankings and amenities. And football -- that's absolutely huge, into millions of dollars paid just to the coaches.

Is there anything like that in the UK? Are there any wild party uni's, with frats and crazyness and all "Animal House," if you ever saw that classic.



My understanding is that doesn't exist, in the UK, or Europe.

So do you think your son is missing out? Personally I think there's TOO MUCH partying in our schools. American dropout rates are actually high. And then they just wind up with bad student loans they can't ever pay back, taken out of their social security check one day when they're old and gray.

I don't know, the frat thing.. it just seems somehow antiquated these days. I kind of think they should all go away.

Like I said, I was working for a darn living at that age.

[Sixstrings]

I knew I would lure out the Beta Males, Social Justice Warriors, and the politically correct. Thanks for your contributions to this thread Sixstrings.

Okay here's the real problem -- in the old days, the dean would just go over and say "alright you knuckleheads take this crap down."

But nowadays.. viral news and viral videos and social media.. every little thing anybody does can become a worldwide outrage.

Maybe.. this isn't even our business, just let the university handle it? There were probably 671 million offensive things that happened in America yesterday, that we don't even know about.

I guess I have to side with you, Cog. This thing is something for the campus newspaper, not national news. We can't have all this total PC stuff going on 24/7 and every business and university is scared to death the moment something goes viral so they have to overreact.

The thing is offensive, yes, but it's like a minor campus issue not a national one.

Heck, yesterday I saw about twenty offensive things at least, in my town. I heard my neighbor say something offensive. Do you all need to know all about that?

[dinopello]

We get it, college age humans have their hormones flowing and they want to impress their peers in whatever way they can. This type of stuff is usually harmless but it is just simply crass and classless. College humor, toilet humor, whatever. I guess the people who would like to ban stuff like this would argue that tolerating it could lead to some of the more pathetically weak among the students to act on the belief that they are there at school to hump everything and that everything there wants to be humped. But, overall it is pretty harmless. I'd be embarrassed if that was my university. Subtle is better.

[Sixstrings]

This type of stuff is usually harmless..

I think the issue is that some women would say that's a threatening environment, for them. Maybe we need a woman's opinion, whether that thing is offensive or not. For a corporate or government workplace? No way, obviously, you can't put a sign up like that. So is a university any different?

See, there's just different standards for different things. Like, a small business versus a corporation. Or, where you are working, whether it's a post office or a biker bar. Or location -- something that's culturally okay and not the end of the world in Virginia, may not be okay in Vermont.

In general, I do think we have too much PC stuff and intolerance of "offensiveness," and something that should be a minor thing goes viral and suddenly the business or school or whatever it is has to overreact and "condemn" and all that, because it affects their public image.

Jeb Bush's PAC actually had to fire its chief technology officer because years ago, when the kid was younger, he tweeted out some offensive jokes:

Jeb Bush Staffer Ousted Over Sexist Tweets, Racist Blog Post
http://gawker.com/jeb-bush-staffer-ousted-over-awful-tweets-about-gays-an-1685104491

I mean, it is actually getting ridiculous.

Someone college age could say something unwise, on their facebook or twitter, and that wind up costing them employment years later. There is no privacy anymore, some joke at a fraternity in Virginia is somehow national news.

[dinopello]

I guess we did have this kind of stuff at my University. Mostly in the form of drinking songs

The Rolling Stone's (mostly false) story of a Rape on campus caused the lyrics to a popular drinking song to be questioned

The first two verses of the song — which are the commonly known — span the subjects of heavy drinking, comradery and sexual encounters.

The first verse reads:
“From Rugby Road to Vinegar Hill, we’re gonna get drunk tonight/
The faculty’s afraid of us; they know we’re in the right/
So fill your cups, your loving cups, as full as full can be/
For as long as love and liquor last we’ll drink to the U. of V.”

The second verse, meanwhile, reads:
“All you girls from Mary Washington/
And R.M.W.C., never let a Cavalier an inch above your knee/
He’ll take you to his fraternity house and fill you full of beer/
And soon you’ll be the mother of a bastard Cavalier!”

According to University Historian Sandy Gilliam, the song comes from a long tradition of university fight songs and is not unique in content. Old editions of Corks and Curls, the University’s yearbook, are filled with drinking songs and stories.

Gilliam said he does not know where the song originated, but speculates it developed sometime after World War I, perhaps as a way for students to protest against restrictions during Prohibition.

Here it is in song.

"Rugby Road" - a University of Virginia drinking song - as performed by the Virginia Glee Club.

Visuals in the video are largely pictures of the legendary "Easters" celebrations in the Madison (Mad) Bowl, dating back to the 1970's and 1980's, which Playboy Magazine referred to as "The Best Party in America."

The song is sung to the tune of Charles Ives' "Son of a Gambolier," the same tune as "Ramblin' Wreck from Georgia Tech." Many of the verses have origins in older drinking songs; for instance, the line about "never let a Virginia man an inch above your knee" echoes the Scottish song "The Dundee Weaver":

"Come aa ye Dundee weavers an tak this advise fae me
Never let a fellae an inch abune yer knee"

While the earliest appearance of the song in the Virginia Glee Club recorded repertoire is the late 1940's record "Songs of the University of Virginia," there is evidence of the song being on Grounds at least a decade earlier; a 1936 issue of the University of Virginia Magazine, in a section titled "From Rugby Road to Vinegar Hill," describes the origin of its name thus:

"Its name is taken from the first line of the song and it goes like this: From Rugby Road to Vinegar Hill, We'll rule this town tonight. The Faculty's afraid of us Because we're in the right. So, fill up a cup, a loving cup As full as full can be..."

Another account has the song sung, alongside other folk classics as "Someone's in the Kitchen with Dinah," in the University hospital precincts during World War II.

The opening of the song is placed by some observers in traditional rebellion of college students against the attempt of the faculty and other authority figures to control or curb social activities.

[Sixstrings]

@Dino
Okay, let's put a finer point on things.

I would say.. there are different cultures, in America.

Every university is different. There are liberal ones, there are "Bob Jones" religious ones, there are more serious ones, then there are state uni "party schools" with wild obnoxious fraternities and you can look up "best party school" rankings lists to find the most fun and most wild university, if that's what one wants.

And there are REGIONAL cultures, in America.

This thing is in Virginia. That's a bit of a "hyper masculine" Southern kind of thing, I think. It may be shockingly "offensive" to people in other, culturally different, parts of the country. Not to pick on the South, look at a place like New Jersey and the Jersey shore -- that's full of hyper masculine "douchebags," too.

And then, in the South, some of our states are all mixed up with people from up North so you've got half of everyone saying something is just fine, and then the other half of the people being outrageously offended.

In my part of the South, culturally, that frat sign would not be okay and everyone ought to know that but don't go overboard about it either and suspend the students.

And issue #2, it's rather screwy that in our modern world this thing is now going to haunt those frat guys maybe 4 years from now when they're looking for a job and the prospective employer googles their name.

P.S. Thinking of women I know, I can't think of any that would be offended by that if they saw that on a fraternity at a university. It's a joke. But still, no, it's not okay. Makes the school look bad. Not exactly a nice thing for parents to see, dropping their daughter off and getting ready to write a big check.

OTOH this stuff is just getting crazy, a bit. There was another issue about a university, where sorority girls just made a video and there was nothing offensive -- but feminists said it was "hyper feminine" and didn't have anyone of color in it.

But it's just someone's darn PRIVATE video on their youtube, so how is that the university's business?

Okay I give up on this, it's just crazy. I blame it all on the internet.

[Subjectivist]

Goofy teenagers do goofy things, the day that stops something is really wrong.

[Outcast_Searcher]

The women have their own greeting to arriving freshmen men.

So, from the context of this thread, then anything like this goes for women? But stuff that's far milder and nuanced by men is causing all kinds of angst?

This reminds me of the politically correct crowd which thinks that only white people can be racist, only straight people can be sexist, etc.

Either we should all relax, or such rules should be enforced impartially and uniformly. (And apparently, if you enter an American university you leave your rights to freedom of speech at the door. So much for an open exchange of ideas as part of the college experience).

[sparky]

.
For pete sake ......undergraduates !!!
what do you expect from young people let off the familly leash for the first time
Gasmon , I regret to say , mechanical Engineers students have a proud tradition
....drinking any social science wanker under the table .

[Subjectivist]

So, from the context of this thread, then anything like this goes for women? But stuff that's far milder and nuanced by men is causing all kinds of angst?

This reminds me of the politically correct crowd which thinks that only white people can be racist, only straight people can be sexist, etc.

Either we should all relax, or such rules should be enforced impartially and uniformly. (And apparently, if you enter an American university you leave your rights to freedom of speech at the door. So much for an open exchange of ideas as part of the college experience).

This is the inherent hypocrisy of the campus PC movement, back in the 80's when I was at Uni I found it oppressive and my understanding is it has only gotten worse since then.

[SeaGypsy]

I'm at University full time atm, in Australia, & could not give a rats arse about the PC movement, which is as rife here as anywhere. Not that I set out to deliberately offend people, but I speak my mind, carefully enough that I can't be prosecuted or sued. I have found from the start of the course the universal horror & indignation at my treading on PC sacred cows, has since turned into I am the definite leader of the definite top group of students in the department. About 1/3 are utterly lost as to how I broke just about every PC rule & wind up being in this position. My opinion is that even the lecturers are sick of PC crap, but only students can break it without risking tenure.

[careinke]

When I attended Wash State University in the mid 70's, on the 8th of May, we celebrated "Outdoor Intercourse Day."

Hooray, Hooray,
for the Eighth of May,
It's Outdoor Intercourse Day.

Any woman walking by Stevens Hall, not wearing a dress, was thrown into "Minerva" (a water fountain outside the dorm).

Of course streaking, LSD, and breaking into the DARPA net to play space games against the USC nerds was popular with both sexes. Then AIDS showed it's ugly face and people had to be responsible again...

[PrestonSturges]

When I attended Wash State University in the mid 70's, on the 8th of May, we celebrated "Outdoor Intercourse Day."

Hooray, Hooray,
for the Eighth of May,
It's Outdoor Intercourse Day.

Any woman walking by Stevens Hall, not wearing a dress, was thrown into "Minerva" (a water fountain outside the dorm).

Of course streaking, LSD, and breaking into the DARPA net to play space games against the USC nerds was popular with both sexes. Then AIDS showed it's ugly face and people had to be responsible again...

Yes the good old days of getting stoned and having unprotected sex with people that were nearly strangers. If some young person looks skeptical I just say "Don't believe me? Ask your mother."