[Shaved Monkey]

https://www.bigfooty.com/forum/proxy.ph ... 5f8c074b0c

[Shaved Monkey]

Former Australian PM suggest Chinas focus is towards the West not the East
If they keep industrialising it will be in the Stans(the old Silk Routes) all undeveloped all providing access for their roads and trains to Europe.
No Navy required
They now have the Islands out on the edge of their continental shelf which basically act as unsinkable aircraft carriers
Stops the US fleet from sailing 6 miles off shore.
US UK GERMANY AUSTRALIA are all 90% urbanised
China is 60% they still have 30% to go then they focus westward and urbanise the Stans
That should generate enough customers for their goods and enough resources to produce them

Its capitalism by a different form much is less wasteful than free markets, that produce less waste and unnecessary duplication and useless production.
The US model required customers and acquisition basically plant as many McDonalds as you can and wait for the profits
Over throw democratically elected unfavourable governments install a friendly government who doesn't necessarily work for the people but frees up their resources in exchange for security.
Chinese model is we dont care who you are or what kind of political system you have heres a few cheap tvs cars and fridges and a road and train line and can we buy some more of your minerals carry on as you please

One system is going to massively out do the other in a very short time as it requires less sticks and makes profit from the carrots.

[jato0072]

Chinese President Xi Jinping and Russian President Vladimir Putin have signed a series of documents on "strategic cooperation" between Beijing and Moscow after what Putin described as "successful and constructive" talks at the Kremlin.

Xi said one of the agreements he signed with Putin brings ties into a "new era" of cooperation.

"We signed a statement on deepening the strategic partnership and bilateral ties, which are entering a new era," Xi said following talks with Putin on March 21 intended to cement the "no limits" partnership the two leaders announced just weeks before Russia invaded Ukraine in February 2022.

Article: Agreements Signed By Putin, Xi Bring Partnership Into 'New Era'

Twitter Link: "Xi Jinping: “Change is coming that hasn’t happened in 100 years and we are driving this change together”

[yellowcanoe]

It's a disappointment that the large and growing economic trade we have with China hasn't been enough to create a friendly relationship. China's tremendous economic growth has instead led to bullying of other Asian countries in the South China Sea and a growing threat of annexing Taiwan through force.

I hope you're just pointing out the facts and it's consequences for the US and not making a statement that what China is doing is somehow inherently evil. The Philippine-American war back at the turn of last century was quite a radical step. The US had already smashed Mexico, a free nation, and then it was on the other side of the pacific enslaving a nation?

In light of what the US has done in it's past what the Chinese are doing today is like courting compared to rape. The simple fact is the world will always be at war, regardless of what some suburban liberals claim about peaceful coexistence. When our side is winning and we are reaping all the benefits it's never a problem. No one complains then. It's only when some other world power rises up that claims of "Injustice" abound.

https://daily.jstor.org/the-ugly-origin ... ilippines/

Yes, it is rather ironic that the United States which celebrates its revolutionary war to gain freedom from Britain would later on choose to acquire an empire by violently taking former Spanish colonies. The number of deaths the US was willing to inflict to retain the Philippines as a colony and suppress the efforts of the people of the Philippines to acquire independence is quite astonishing. However, I don't think aggressive acts of the US in the past justify what China is doing in the South Asian Sea or its threats to invade Taiwan.

[jato0072]

One can go crazy trying to untangle history. At this point, I would be happy enough to take a hit to my standard of living and all together avoid WW3.

[Plantagenet]

While the US and EU countries are planning to reduce the amount of oil they use, China is going the opposite direction. China keeps INCREASING the amount of oil they expect to be using in the future. And now that China has secured commitments from Saudi to supply them with oil, China AGAIN just increased the amount of oil they expect to use in the future.

-saudis-push-peak-oil-even-higher-in-china

The US is spending trillions to shift to EVs. Supposedly the US is doing this to reduce oil use and cut CO2 emissions. But the increases in oil consumption being planned by China will totally swamp the US reductions, resulting in net increases in global CO2 going into the global atmosphere and producing even more global warming.


Hey China......thanks for all the global warming!!!

Cheers!

[theluckycountry]

One can go crazy trying to untangle history. At this point, I would be happy enough to take a hit to my standard of living and all together avoid WW3.

Well taking a 'Hit' is sort of baked in the cake for the indebted Western nations now either way. But if I look at all the previous world wars the thoughts and desires of the people only came into it after a massive propaganda push by their governments, based on Fear, and it was never a push for peace.

The war on Terror! The Vietnam War to stop the spread of evil communism; The gulf war and the Fear of weapons of Mass Destruction. And now we have the ukraine war and the Fear that Russia is trying to undermine Democracy in the West. China though is playing a very circumspect game, It just wants it's former lands back and to grow rich through trading. After it secures Taiwan, neutralizes it as a US base basically, I believe it's military push will be over.

The US military base in Taiwan is Ching Chuan Kang Air Base (CCK), located in Taichung. It was used by the US Air Force as a support installation and a nuclear missile site during the Cold War. In 2022, US marines began a training operation in Taiwan to help its military's combat readiness

[Plantagenet]

China ... just wants it's former lands back and to grow rich through trading. After it secures Taiwan, neutralizes it as a US base basically, I believe its military push will be over.

Why would you think that?

There really isn't any historical precedent for authoritarian regimes voluntarily stopping their aggression against neighboring countries.

The people who become dictators of murderous authoritarian regimes sometimes are brutal murderous psychopaths, who just can't help themselves from attacking neighboring countries.

For example...just look at Putin.



Cheers!

[theluckycountry]

China ... just wants it's former lands back and to grow rich through trading. After it secures Taiwan, neutralizes it as a US base basically, I believe its military push will be over.

Why would you think that?

Because, they are one of the oldest civilizations on the planet, they have NO history of colonizing other nations, or attacking other nations that didn't encroach on their borders. "Korean War"

There really isn't any historical precedent for authoritarian regimes voluntarily stopping their aggression against neighboring countries.

Your point is unclear? And false. Wasn't mexico an authoritarian regime when America invaded it and stole it's lands. Did they not voluntarily stop aggression, after it was obvious they were outgunned?

The people who become dictators of murderous authoritarian regimes sometimes are brutal murderous psychopaths, who just can't help themselves from attacking neighboring countries.

Did Pol Pot? Idi Edi Amin? No, they were content with tormenting their own people's. I'm sorry plant but you are way out of your depth here, you seem to scope-locked on Putin Putin Putin. and because the Chinese are allied with Russia, the Chinese leader as well. I think you have mistaken TV watching for education, a common mistake these days. If I were giving you this lecture a couple of years ago you would be citing Kim Jong il, a couple of decades before that, Saddam Hussein.

For example...just look at Putin.

Putin Putin Putin.
Putin Putin Putin.
Putin Putin Putin.

[Plantagenet]

{China} one of the oldest civilizations on the planet, they have NO history of colonizing other nations, or attacking other nations that didn't encroach on their borders.

Thats not true at all. Where do you get these bizarre ideas anyway?

The Chinese have a long history of invading and conquering the lands surrounding the Han homelands where China originated. There are many many minority ethnic groups in modern China who lost their lands due to past invasions and conquest the Han Chinese.

The same thing continues into modern times. I was just traveling in Vietnam, for instance, and the Vietnamese are very wary of China because Vietnam has had to fight off Chinese invaders multiple times in their history, with the most recent Chinese invasion coming just 40 years ago.


VietNam had to fight off a Chinese invasion just 40 years ago.

Right now China is in occupation of Tibet, which they invaded in 1954. And, of course, the Chinese are currently holding over a million Uighers in concentration camps because China invaded their country in 1759, but still hasn't entirely pacified it.

There really isn't any historical precedent for authoritarian regimes voluntarily stopping their aggression against neighboring countries.

Your point is unclear?

I'm sorry you don't understand. Please allow me to explain my point in simpler terms.
1. China is governed by an authoritarian regime.
2. There isn't any historical precedent for authoritarian regimes voluntarily ending all aggression against neighboring countries.


Do you get it now?

The people who become dictators of murderous authoritarian regimes sometimes are brutal murderous psychopaths, who just can't help themselves from attacking neighboring countries.

Did Pol Pot? Idi Edi Amin? No, they were content with tormenting their own people's.

You are proving my point again.

If you think Pol Pot and Idi Amin are examples of virtuous rulers of authoritarian regimes because they did't attack neighboring countries you aren't thinking this through.

My point is exactly that authoritarian regimes have a sad tendency to elevate psychotic killers like Pol Pot and Idi Amin and Stalin and Hiter and Mao and Putin to positions of leadership, and such people are clearly very dangerous because they are psychotic killers.

You have a great day over there in China....it's always nice chatting with you.

Cheers!

[ralfy]

China has been building installations in the sea, together with Taiwan, Malaysia, the Philippines, and Vietnam, to counter any U.S. possibilities of blockading. Also, interestingly enough, the country with the most installations isn't China but Vietnam.

Some more points to consider:

China's claim to most of the sea actually comes from Taiwan, which retains the same. Taiwan is not recognized as a sovereign state by almost all countries, and has both China and the U.S. as major trading partners. I recall one recent article stating that Taiwan argues that sanctions against China involving microchips is actually hurting Taiwan.

Vietnam has China as a major trading partner, but is bullied by it. The U.S. is trying to sell armaments to Vietnam but the main military ally of Vietnam is Russia.

Taiwan, a military ally, claims most of the West Philippine sea, which is also claimed by the Philippines, another military ally.

The current bully of the Philippines is China. The country that bullied it for decades is the U.S. Its main supporter is Japan, which attacked the Philippines viciously during WW2 and is disliked by China, Taiwan, and South Korea. Japan is currently buying oil from Russia, in defiance of sanctions.

One of the countries eager to sell arms to the Philippines isn't the U.S. but India. One of the allies of India is Russia. One recent source indicates that some European countries have been buying Russian oil via India.

The U.S. is trying to get the Philippines to work with Australia and Japan. One of the major trading partners of Australia is China. France is now going against the U.S. for screwing up arms sales that France was making with Australia. France is now selling gas to China in exchange for yuans, which is causing the petrodollar to weaken. Before that Saudi Arabia was meeting to sell oil to China in exchange for yuans, too.

De-dollarization has been accelerating as more countries are slowly moving away from the dollar and trading with each other more freely. China, Malaysia, and others have been meeting with each other, planning to use other currencies, special drawing rights, and other means for trade. Countries like Tunisia are moving away from the IMF-WB and towards BRICS and emerging markets for credit.

[ralfy]

"Strategic ambiguity" is now being abandoned:

https://twitter.com/RnaudBertrand/statu ... 9111297024

[AdamB]

China poses biggest threat to global security, says Sunak

China poses the biggest challenge to global security and prosperity of our age with the “means and intent to reshape the world order”, Rishi Sunak has said.

The UK prime minister said G7 leaders including Japan, the US, Canada and European nations had shown “unity and resolve” in confronting the problems posed by Beijing.

[Newfie]

New demographic data out of China shows their demographic status is worse than previously thought.

Zeihan has a short (5 min) video on the matter.

https://youtu.be/kBMSZ7v3KxQ

Looks like China will be bending into degrowth shortly.

[ralfy]

"What are Gallium and Germanium? China curbs exports of metals critical to chips and other tech"

https://www.cnbc.com/2023/07/04/what-ar ... -tech.html

[theluckycountry]

New demographic data out of China shows their demographic status is worse than previously thought. Looks like China will be bending into degrowth shortly.

No doubt. The Japanese are way ahead on this curve I believe and that has been blamed for their stagnant economy over the "lost decades". In once sense back when communist countries like China an Russia were in their heydays they could (the leadership that is) fair better because they could force their people to embark on whatever social engineering programs they wanted. China still does this to a degree and probably Russia too. I wonder what possible responses might come from the leadership? I mean if we're discussing it here they must have been long ago and perhaps formulated a plan...

Excess population is not necessarily a benefit to nations as a whole. At a certain point it makes sense to have a cull, to reset things so there is more resources per capita. That's just a cruel fact of life I'm afraid. Those that survived events like the Black Death fared very well from all reports, houses got cheaper and there was more food available, more firewood. It was just tough if you were one of the dead.

Ironically, the plague did have some benefit. Plague survivors enjoyed a higher standard of living, due to a sudden overabundance of land and goods. Rigid societies became more flexible as deaths at the top encouraged upward mobility. A attitude of questioning authority and existing dogmas came into being, as a result of the church and state’s inability to contain the outbreaks. The plague is even credited for changing attitudes towards life and death, with the result that the wealthy became patrons of artists, writers and architects—the foundation of the Renaissance.

https://nationalinterest.org/blog/reboo ... ory-193525

We as comfortable citizens of wealthy western nations abhor the idea of population control and dieoff because at some level we probably see it as a personal risk. What if I'm one of those that dieoff? We have everything we want and don't want to see disruption to the Status Quo. I think that's how I perceive it anyway. Sure the world is in a frightful mess, but not in my little corner of it.

[ralfy]

https://twitter.com/nxt888/status/1681387905460350976

Wow, the irony is off the charts! The US pointing fingers at China for being a global threat while being the bully on the block themselves! They've got a rap sheet longer than my grocery list, with military interventions, secret ops, and regime change galore!

But wait, it gets better! The anti-China hysteria is like a magician's trick – a sleight of hand to distract Americans from their own juicy issues! Social inequality, racism, and political polarization are the real party crashers, but instead of dealing with them, they're playing "blame China" charades!

[ralfy]

https://twitter.com/ricwe123/status/1682303404436082688

Singaporean diplomat,author and geopolitical consultant Kishore Mahbubani sheds light on the changing global dynamics.

Despite American efforts, China's influence grows as many nations remain neutral in the US-China contest.

[theluckycountry]

Despite American efforts, China's influence grows as many nations remain neutral in the US-China contest.

Just a repeat of WWII. The British French and Americans sitting back watching as the axis powers radically armed themselves. Japan had more aircraft carriers than the US at the outset of war, I assumed they waited until they had a numerical superiority before they began their conquest of the Asiatic nations around them. Beware nations achieving numerical superiority.

[jato0072]

Don't worry. I have just been informed by the Minister of Truth that the West is about to win in Ukraine. China will have to think twice when they see our proxy war power level!