yellowcanoe wrote:Replacing the capitalist system is a cornerstone of the degrowth movement. Capitalism is geared towards never ending economic growth and increased resource consumption.
So is socialism.
I'm afraid that "economic growth" and "increased resource consumption" has occurred in even the most backward and totalitarian socialist countries? As population grows, economies tend to grow.
yellowcanoe wrote:Our number one problem is that we are consuming resources at a rate far beyond what the planet can replenish and climate change is a subset of this problem so it is understandable that degrowth would require replacing capitalism as we know it now.
Not really, no. That doesn't follow at all.
Clearly we need to reduce our use of fossil fuels, but its not clear that requires replacing capitalism.
In fact, since capitalism is the most efficient economic system, the best way to reduce fossil use and solve other environmental problems may well be to make it unprofitable to use fossil fuels and more profitable to use renewable energy, and then count on greed and other capitalist incentives to drive talented people to find the solution to the problem of exactly how best to do that.
yellowcanoe wrote:I recently read "The future is Degrowth, A Guide to a World beyond Capitalism". They never use the word communism to describe what they are proposing but the emphasis on a more equitable distribution of income certainly reminded me of communism. I am rather disappointed with the degrowth movement. They seem to believe we can drastically cut consumption in first world countries while simultaneously increasing consumption in third world countries while maintaining a good quality of life for everyone. What was especially irritating was the idea that borders should be completely open.
I haven't read that book. Thanks for the information.
I agree with you 100% on your discomfort at the idea of removing national borders. Here in the USA Joe Biden has essentially removed our southern border and millions of impoverished people are now streaming into the USA.....just as we are about to go into an economic recession. Its not a very smart policy, IMHO.
yellowcanoe wrote:You are absolutely right about communist countries having a higher level of pollution than Western countries. The German government had quite the cleanup job after reunification with East Germany.
Exactly right. I saw the same things when I visited the USSR......it was the most polluted place I have ever seen. The waterfronts were littered with rusting hulks and huge lines of abandoned obsolete cranes. The stores were almost completely empty. The apartments (all government owned) were decrepit and collapsing.
IMHO once you "end capitalism" you inevitably get the government in charge of everything and there is no incentive for the government to reduce its own pollution.....when the government owns everything including "the means of production" there is no economic competition so no product ever gets any better, and there is no independent media and there is no independent counter culture and no people with independent wealth in society that can be critical of government and sue the government in order to provide a check on the government.
Mixed economies, like the USA, Germany, and other western countries work very well, with the capitalist sector being the economic engine that pumps out wealth to the entire society. But purely socialist/communist economies are inevitably static and unsuccessful, IMHO.
abandoned, obsolete rusting cranes line the waterfronts of Russian cities....Nice chatting with you.
CHEERS!